|
Author
|
Topic: Whats the best combo u can think of to run solid 10's N/A?
|
CDT
¯
Member # 5004
|
posted
 
 
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
Evan said the 10.86 was in my old car! Yay yay! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
yeah just like it was when you had it, except for the motor and tires
--------------------
Custom Dyno Tuning
510.331.0608
Home of Flat Fee Tuning For All Cars, Trucks and SUV's, EFI & Carb, SCT, AFR, Dynatech, STS Turbos, N2O Refills
Posts: 1053 | From: Hayward | Registered: Nov 2004
| :
|
|
FasterDamnit
Bad Attitude
Member # 442
|
posted
And several years worth of dirt...
--------------------
'92 LX T5
Looked stock, went 11's 11.90 at 115mph.
'65 Mustang 347
www.fordmuscle.com
Livin' in the Carolina Pines
Posts: 2971 | From: NorCal | Registered: Sep 2001
| :
|
|
STREETFIGHTER50
unregistered
|
posted
Nice read up, but I couldn't view the rest. I need to subscribe. How much did the G-Force T-5 run u Drew?
:
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
Main cap girdles are near worthless. If aluminum they can actually do harm to the motor (expands at a different rate than the Iron mains & can push the main away from each other unless there is 'play' in the girdle where it mates to the studs.....in which case what good is it?). If you must have one, steel is the way to go, but it will not keep a stock block from splitting at 600RWHP.
blah blah blah.... tell me something new shaun. ![[Razz]](tongue.gif) hehe i know it wont stop the block from splitting. but by tieing all the caps together and by making them like one, it really helps to prevent the caps from moving forwards and backwards. it also helps by preventing the caps from jumping up and down which is what can happen during detonation. ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by rico91stang:
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
Main cap girdles are near worthless. If aluminum they can actually do harm to the motor (expands at a different rate than the Iron mains & can push the main away from each other unless there is 'play' in the girdle where it mates to the studs.....in which case what good is it?). If you must have one, steel is the way to go, but it will not keep a stock block from splitting at 600RWHP.
See.. ![[patriot]](graemlins/patriot.gif)
you still haven't told me why a girdle is "BAD." i'm not talking about aluminum.
and who said it prevents the block from splitting?
[ January 02, 2006, 04:35 PM: Message edited by: stoauto ]
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
88DroptopGT
¯
Member # 2535
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
Nice read up, but I couldn't view the rest. I need to subscribe. How much did the G-Force T-5 run u Drew?
Yeah I'm wondering that also. Does it beat the price of a TKO? I found a gear shop close to Concord that will put a G-force kit into a T5 for $250.00.
I also read that the T-5 casing is a weak point (from Corral) and some of their kits are hit and miss due to their hardening techniques. It's like a 10 page thread over there I'll try to find a link later.
Posts: 3978 | From: 707 | Registered: Mar 2003
| :
|
|
Yellow94GT
Mr. 60 FT
Member # 431
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
Nice read up, but I couldn't view the rest. I need to subscribe. How much did the G-Force T-5 run u Drew?
I believe my gear set was around $1100 with all the upgrades. Labor for installing the gear set I guess ranges on where you have it done. I use a place called Modern Driveline for all my tranny work, www.moderndriveline.com If you are interested I would send them an email. Bruce, (the owner), will email you back all the details. I wouldn't bother calling. Some dude will answer the phone who never knows anything...lol
Make sure you mention my name
--------------------
AED
1994 GT Bucket that will likely never run
1999 SLOLEEN Twin Turbo Coyote
2008 F250 580 RWHP 1129 RWTQ
Posts: 5990 | From: Cameron Park, Ca | Registered: Sep 2001
| :
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Yellow94GT:
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
Nice read up, but I couldn't view the rest. I need to subscribe. How much did the G-Force T-5 run u Drew?
I believe my gear set was around $1100 with all the upgrades. Labor for installing the gear set I guess ranges on where you have it done. I use a place called Modern Driveline for all my tranny work, www.moderndriveline.com If you are interested I would send them an email. Bruce, (the owner), will email you back all the details. I wouldn't bother calling. Some dude will answer the phone who never knows anything...lol
Make sure you mention my name
ahhh yes, modern driveline, correction... owner with a S at the end. Bruce and Will. its a shame there moving to idaho, they do excellent work.
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
twins
¯
Member # 5069
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
Evan said the 10.86 was in my old car! Yay yay!
THATS MY OLD CAR TOO.
Posts: 559 | From: leandro | Registered: Nov 2004
| :
|
|
Yellow94GT
Mr. 60 FT
Member # 431
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by stoauto:
quote:
Originally posted by Yellow94GT:
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
Nice read up, but I couldn't view the rest. I need to subscribe. How much did the G-Force T-5 run u Drew?
I believe my gear set was around $1100 with all the upgrades. Labor for installing the gear set I guess ranges on where you have it done. I use a place called Modern Driveline for all my tranny work, www.moderndriveline.com If you are interested I would send them an email. Bruce, (the owner), will email you back all the details. I wouldn't bother calling. Some dude will answer the phone who never knows anything...lol
Make sure you mention my name
ahhh yes, modern driveline, correction... owner with a S at the end. Bruce and Will. its a shame there moving to idaho, they do excellent work.
Them moving to Iadho will work out great for me, I'm planning on moving there in the next couple years myself
--------------------
AED
1994 GT Bucket that will likely never run
1999 SLOLEEN Twin Turbo Coyote
2008 F250 580 RWHP 1129 RWTQ
Posts: 5990 | From: Cameron Park, Ca | Registered: Sep 2001
| :
|
|
JoeT
¯
Member # 298
|
posted
for 'easy' mid 10 second ET's NA I'd personally go for a 460/C4 combo with whatever H/C and carb intake I could find, I believe it runs around $2500 or so for the engine itself. pretty impressive to do it on the 302 blocks though, just not 'easy' IMHO.
--------------------
1984 Ford Tempo AOD--- RIP
Posts: 6785 | From: San Jose | Registered: Jun 2001
| :
|
|
|
|
Eagle347
¯
Member # 6205
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by rico91stang:
Girdles do close to almost nothing when it comes to strengthening a 302 block. Just keeps it in a nice pile when the block splits. Vally pan girdles are somewhat cool though.
http://www.turbomustangs.com/techarticles/stockblock.php
Q: Will a main stud girdle help keep the block from breaking?
A: Ha, ha, no. All it will is hold all the parts together in a tidy pile. Some of the failures pictured below were equipped with stud girdles.
Also from what I read from 93 pony certain ones deflect if I remember correctly because of heat. Maybe he can chime in on it.
How bad is the damage when the block splits like that? Obviously the block is trashed, but what about everything else?
--------------------
1995 Mustang GTS 1 of 1002 deep forest green GTS's made. Bone stock.
1990 Coupe 347 NX E85 Nitrous kit
Posts: 712 | From: Dayton, OH | Registered: Nov 2005
| :
|
|
93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by stoauto:
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
Main cap girdles are near worthless. If aluminum they can actually do harm to the motor (expands at a different rate than the Iron mains & can push the main away from each other unless there is 'play' in the girdle where it mates to the studs.....in which case what good is it?). If you must have one, steel is the way to go, but it will not keep a stock block from splitting at 600RWHP.
blah blah blah.... tell me something new shaun. hehe i know it wont stop the block from splitting. but by tieing all the caps together and by making them like one, it really helps to prevent the caps from moving forwards and backwards. it also helps by preventing the caps from jumping up and down which is what can happen during detonation.
How can a main girdle hold the caps from moving around? It does not possitively lock the main caps to the gridle....not like a rocker stud girdle that possitiviely locks all poly-locks & studs together. A main girdle sits on top of the caps....just like a washer & bolt head does. If the caps are going to walk with a washer/bolt torqued to 75ft/lbs, they'll walk with a girdle on top of the washers torqued to 75ft/lbs. The bolts/studs are a fairly loose fit in the main caps. Tying all the bolts/studs together will help the studs/bolts from moving, but the caps themselves can still move around the bolts/studs. With clearances in the .0015-.002 range, any amount of movement can be detramental... If the main girdle does not possitively hold the caps themselves, it can not hold the caps from walking.
As for the caps jumping up & down......I can see it helping out there. Then again, don't detonate the bitch!
Aluminum girdles can be a bad thing....simply because the aluminum expands at nearly twice the rate of Iron & can push the bolts/studs which can affect clearances. For this reason the aluminum girdles out there are not a 'tight' fit...
Most think that girdles are neccessary when power exceeds 500RW...as if a girdle is going to give them an added measure of saftey at high HP levels. By design it's ment to control cap walk at high RPM's... (which id doesn't do very well). It's a big-ass marketing ploy if you ask me.
--------------------
www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
| :
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
i see where your coming from, and it does make sense, but we've machined and freshened SEVERAL high performance motors that have not had girdles, some good some bad, and when a motor detonates or has cap walk it leaves metal behind on the caps and block where the caps sit. by adding a girdle in our experience minimized or eliminated those problems. a girdle is never a bad thing if you ask me. or you could always just do the dart block upgrade.
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
|
posted
Gotta love the Dart!
I've got an 8.2 deck in my car.....when I buy one for the wife I think one of us will end up with a 9.5 deck. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
--------------------
www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
| :
|
|
93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by stoauto:
i see where your coming from, and it does make sense, but we've machined and freshened SEVERAL high performance motors that have not had girdles, some good some bad, and when a motor detonates or has cap walk it leaves metal behind on the caps and block where the caps sit. by adding a girdle in our experience minimized or eliminated those problems. a girdle is never a bad thing if you ask me. or you could always just do the dart block upgrade.
Haven't seen that myself...
What I have seen is girdled 4.6 iron blocks....aluminum girdles. What a big-ass waste of money! The 4.6 is a 'Y' block desing...very strong & locks the main caps in multiple ways (depending on Romeo vs Windsor).
--------------------
www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
| :
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
some things you'll only see/learn at a machine shop. j/k. later.
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
Gotta love the Dart!
I've got an 8.2 deck in my car.....when I buy one for the wife I think one of us will end up with a 9.5 deck.
so uhh, wheres mine? christmas was over a week ago.
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
STREETFIGHTER50
unregistered
|
posted
I'd still run a girdle on our stock block rebuilds. Just not an aluminum one I don't know, I guess it just makes me feel a little more secure & it's cheap anyways. Shaun, are u runnin one on ur wife's car? How about ur car, Drew?
[ January 04, 2006, 04:57 AM: Message edited by: STREETFIGHTER50 ]
:
|
|
Yellow94GT
Mr. 60 FT
Member # 431
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
I'd still run a girdle on our stock block rebuilds. Just not an aluminum one I don't know, I guess it just makes me feel a little more secure & it's cheap anyways. Shaun, are u runnin one on ur wife's car? How about ur car, Drew?
I run one.
--------------------
AED
1994 GT Bucket that will likely never run
1999 SLOLEEN Twin Turbo Coyote
2008 F250 580 RWHP 1129 RWTQ
Posts: 5990 | From: Cameron Park, Ca | Registered: Sep 2001
| :
|
|
stoauto
¯
Member # 2803
|
posted
my main point is, there is nothing "bad" about runnin a girdle, period. even if some think it only helps a little, so what, its better than nothing. everyone has there own theories.
Posts: 1054 | Registered: May 2003
| :
|
|
STREETFIGHTER50
unregistered
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Yellow94GT:
quote:
Originally posted by t top freak:
quote:
Originally posted by Yellow94GT:
quote:
Originally posted by STREETFIGHTER50:
10.86@127.00 1.52 ET Drags, Sac stoauto 89LX Carb'ed N/A 347
10.92@123.9 1.495 ET Drags Sac Yellow94GT94GT, N/A 347
10.98@125.73 1.55, ET Drags, SAC 91pony 91GT N/A 347 (93Pony Driving)
Did yall run these times on seasoned stock blocks or aftermarket? Also, what transmissions are yall runnin?
Stock block and G Force T5
how do you like that tranny?
Eh, its ok.
Hey Drew, would say the G-Force is better than a TKO?
:
|
|
Yellow94GT
Mr. 60 FT
Member # 431
|
posted
For my application I think the G Force is better. The G Force isn't as strong as a TKO but it is plenty for the stage of the game that I'm in. Holds the power and saves a ton of weight over the TKO.
--------------------
AED
1994 GT Bucket that will likely never run
1999 SLOLEEN Twin Turbo Coyote
2008 F250 580 RWHP 1129 RWTQ
Posts: 5990 | From: Cameron Park, Ca | Registered: Sep 2001
| :
|
|
93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
|
posted
No I don't run a girdle....wouldn't waste my money on one.
My 331 TT stock block combo had a Probe 1/2" Steel girdle on it. (basically the strongest one you can get.) The caps were machined for the girdle & once installed the mains were line-bore/honed. (The recomended way to install a girdle)
The motor made 430/508RW max & never reved behond 6400rpm.
That block is sitting at the shop.....twisted & unsuable. #2 main twisted .002"....which is enough to lock up the crank. Block may be cracked.....at the very least it's twisted.
Cheap? I wouldn't call it cheap. The Probe 3/8" Steel girdle is what....$179? 1/2" is $325. Then add machine work if you want it installed correctly. How much is it to line bore/hone the mains these days? How about machining the main caps to fit the girdle? Add all that up & you'll be in it around $400-$600.....which is definately not CHEAP insurance in my book.
That money would be beter spent upgrading the stock block to a Dart, R302, Boss, World, etc. You can find these blocks used for good prices sometimes.
However, if it gives you piece of mind to buy a main girdle.....I guess that's really what they're selling.
My opinion:
If you plan on pushing the limits of the stock block, it's money WELL spent in the long run to upgrade to a stronger block.
There's a saying among engine builders.... You don't put a $2000 rotating assembly in a $200 block. & you don't put a $200 rotating assembly in a $2000 block.
--------------------
www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
| :
|
|
Email this post to someone!
Printer friendly view of this Ford topic
![[burnout]](graemlins/burnout.gif)
