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Originally posted by 4.6 EATIN GM'S:

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Originally posted by triple b:
you cant bulk up and lose fat at the same time one or the other lose the fat and muscle first then bulk up muscle then cut the muscle to lean out that the way its always been

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wrong, i have lost 35 pounds so far in 8 months. and while i have been losing wieght and fat i have been converting it into lean muscle. i have lost inches in certain areas and have gained inches in the areas i wanted to. im thinner than i was when i started but im muscular in other areas.
when i started i wanted to get thinner and lose 50-60 pounds but i wanted to bulk up at the same time. i realized i had to focus on one or the other. i chose to convert my extra fat into muscle. i do little cardio to get the heart rate up and then i lift. i started out at 32% body fat and now i roughly 20-22% body fat.i dont eat junk but i also eat the most healthiest stuff either. i take in tons of protien daily and drink tons of water. i also try to eat something small every couple of hours to keep my metabolism going. if you dont eat your body starts to think its startving and stores your fat.

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Originally posted by triple b:
you really want to lose weight get educated go see a doctor or registered dietitian no your local bodybuilder or heaven sake physical trainer there are people who have a Masters degree in this area and not just "certified" lol if you were really serious you would be asking the right questions to the right people and not on a car website

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There are lots of well rounded peeps here. You never know who knows what or has what degree in what. This is a car site, but if someone happened to come along and wanted to write a web service using JSON, I could help them. But oh yea, this is just a car site. No one is supposed to be knowledgeable in anything but right?

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Originally posted by triple b:
dont get your panties in a bunch yeah it is just a car site "cafords" lol no i didnt say anyone here is stupid just putting my two cents out there but wait is that ok should I ask you first since you and a "select" few know how to build muscle and lose fat at the same time....jeez maybe you should patent your technique and be a millionare

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Originally posted by triple b:
Like mike if could be like mike i mean N8

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Originally posted by Big block 66 f100:

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Originally posted by triple b:
Like mike if could be like mike i mean N8

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Unwanted sarcasm ^^^

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Originally posted by N8:

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Originally posted by triple b:
dont get your panties in a bunch yeah it is just a car site "cafords" lol no i didnt say anyone here is stupid just putting my two cents out there but wait is that ok should I ask you first since you and a "select" few know how to build muscle and lose fat at the same time....jeez maybe you should patent your technique and be a millionare

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hahahha. your panties are in a bunch. I am cool, best believe. Like I said, I live it and do it. But to think that people cannot have valid views of nutrition, fitness or anything else because this is a "car site" is kinda single minded.

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Originally posted by triple b:
HCG is a fad look at the diet HCG with less than 1000k a day diet...any can drop weight on that meal plan with HcG or without no fad diet here i lost 30lbs on diet and exercise alone took 6 months but guess what the weigh didnt come back and now i dont have to be in the gym everyday to stay lean

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Originally posted by N8:

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Originally posted by triple b:
HCG is a fad look at the diet HCG with less than 1000k a day diet...any can drop weight on that meal plan with HcG or without no fad diet here i lost 30lbs on diet and exercise alone took 6 months but guess what the weigh didnt come back and now i dont have to be in the gym everyday to stay lean

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There is a echo in here.

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Originally posted by Big block 66 f100:
Ok new plans you guys my new question is how do i maintain the muscle i have already built but cut this fat because walking around at over 300 is taking a toll on my body so for now i need to drop at least 50 pounds asap...

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Originally posted by cobraracer46:
To quote N8;
"As for diet still maintain the 1g of protein for every pound you weigh." This is incorrect.

looking at my college nutrition text book, I get the following formula to determine the proper protein intake;
.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight so when you convert kilos to pounds and run the numbers you get;

300 pounds divided by 2.2= 136
136X.8= 108 grams of protein.

Too much protein can enlarge your kidneys and may worsen existing kidney conditions. Second, Animal protein can be high in saturated fat and saturated fat is a risk factor for heart problems.

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Originally posted by cobraracer46:
Lets have some fun.
Suppose a 300 pound CAFORDS member follows N8's 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight? how do you meet it.
You could consume 6 cans of star light tuna to get 300 grams of protein, but then you also get 1500 calories.
What about fats and carbs? 1500 calories of protein does not leave much room for fat and carbohydrate calorie needs.

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"As mentioned earlier, the RDA is 0.8 grams per kilogram of lean bodyweight (U.S. Food and Nutrition Board, 1980) for sedentary adults. For infants and children the RDA is doubled and tripled because of the rapid growth rate they experience. How did the researchers come up with this RDA and arrive at the figure that has been shunned by the bodybuilding community? Studies using nitrogen (a component of protein). have been conducted to see how much protein is used and absorbed before an excess condition results.

Researchers looked at the nitrogen balance and made comparisons to see if a positive or a negative balance had been occurring. They observed the outcome by comparing the amount of nitrogen excreted with the amount ingested, and then they determined whether or not protein was accumulating in the body, remaining at the same level, or decreasing.

The nitrogen balance test uses nitrogen loss in the form of sweat, urine, feces, shedding of skin, and loss of hair on a day-to-day basis. If there is a positive balance in nitrogen levels, it means there has been more nitrogen ingested than excreted, and so, tissue growth can be a direct result. A negative balance shows researchers that more nitrogen is being excreted than taken in, and this means, of course, that more protein is being lost than produced. Basically, the protein requirement for sedentary adults involves replacing routine losses-the task, so to speak, is to keep the leaky bucket topped up.

So why did researchers in North America come to the conclusion that the RDA is only a rationed 0.8 grams per kilogram? Well it seems they concluded that 0.36 grams per kilogram of lean bodyweight in protein is lost per day. With a safety margin in place, it has been bumped up to 0.45 grams per kilogram of lean bodyweight, and then bumped up again to approximately 0.75 grams per kilogram. This is to replace the amount which may be lost during digestion, as well as making up for a lack in quality of protein.

The general protein requirement for sedentary adults is just enough that if one follows this guideline they will supply themselves with enough amino acids to replace each day's loss without allowing for exercise and the growth of muscle tissue. It's ironic that the RDA for children (who are experiencing growth) is greater than the RDA for adults. The Academy of Sciences and the nutrition board insist that exercise (which leads to musculo-collagenous hypertrophy among other changes in the body) doesn't generate an increase in one's protein requirements (1). Note that RDA can vary from place to place; Russia, Denmark, and Britain have different RDA standards.

Exercise adds a new dimension to the issue because the body, with an increased need for protein, has to rely heavily upon dietary sources rather than draw from it's own stores. If this need is not met during exercise then the body will start to draw upon its muscle tissue as a source. Though it may seem that humans don't need much protein, the facts haven't been established as to how much an exercising individual should be taking in.

Recent research shows that the RDA doesn't appear to meet the needs of exercising adults. One of the top researchers in this field, Dr Peter Lemon, stated in a recent review paper that, "the RDA for those engaged in strength training should be about 1.7 - 1.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body mass per day". Dr Lemon came to this conclusion after citing several studies (Fern, 1991, Tarnopolsky et al., 1992) which used amounts of protein ranging from 1.3 - 3.3 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight.

At Kent University researchers tested 3 different groups of people:

1. On a low protein diet which was 0.9 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight.
2. Another group eating 1.4 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight.
3. A group eating 2.4 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight.

Both sedentary and strength training groups were involved. The results showed that 1.4 grams resulted in protein synthesis while there were no changes in the low protein group and, finally, the group that ingested 2.4 grams of protein did not see any more increased protein synthesis than the 1.4 grams of protein group.

Another study conducted at the Letterman Army Institute of Research in San Francisco showed that subjects on a higher protein intake (2.8 g/kg/day), coupled with intense strength training, gained a whopping 3.28 kg (7.2 lbs) of lean mass. The study was done over a 40-day period and the subjects were trained to near exhaustion (2). Another study of weightlifters over a 3 month period, with the protein increased from 2.2g/kg/day to 3.5 g/kg/ day, resulted in a 6% increase in muscle mass and a 5% increase in strength (3).

Susan M Klieiner, who holds a PhD in nutrition and human performance from Case Western Reserve University, states in her book, Power Eating, that for muscle building an intake of 1.6-2.2 grams per kilogram of bodyweight is recommended. Dr Michael Colgan, in Optimum Sports Nutrition, claims that the RDA doesn't meet the needs of athletes who train in an intense fashion. So, the evidence provided by some of the highly regarded "experts" in this field indicates that the addition of extra protein has been shown to display positive effects which produce muscle growth. "

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