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Author
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Topic: Kenne Bell or Procharger????
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98 cobra wannabe
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Member # 1045
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posted
 
 
Ok, I have been saving for a while for a supercharger since i have a shitty job & all, it takes forever, I was thinking of going with the Procharger intercooled system, but my brother tells me i should go with kenne bell roots type.
i figured if anyone could help it would be you guys. Thanks in advance ![[worship]](graemlins/worship.gif) ![[patriot]](graemlins/patriot.gif)
Posts: 15 | Registered: Mar 2002
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Stimson
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Member # 51
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posted
I wouldn't listen to anything else your brother says ![[Wink]](wink.gif) The kennebell will make about 50+ less RWHP. Sure, you'll have great throttle response, but you won't be able to keep up with many all motor LS1's and will be far behind centrifical blower 4V's.
Posts: 2373 | Registered: Jun 2000
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2001s281
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Member # 653
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posted
the new kennebelle roots blower is sweet, it gives a ton of torque and wont run out of power in the higher rpms like other roots type. go to muscle mustangs and fast fords they did an article on the new kennebelle u might be amazed.
Posts: 135 | From: san jose | Registered: Dec 2001
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Spdfreak LS1
Board idiot
Member # 679
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posted
i was told the root style blowers give quick hp but in the long run, the regular superchargers will pass them up. but for my $0.02 ide go with a procharger and a 3 core intercooler.
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Juice times to come!!
http://www.thesiccrew.com/Kevin.html
http://www.geocities.com/kevtopgun/Z28.html
12.9 and 111mph traps on Street tires.
quote:
Originally posted by FireWhore:
..... nor do i care what any of u peeps think....or me for that matter....
Posts: 2202 | From: Sacramento | Registered: Dec 2001
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Wolfie351
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Member # 651
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posted
I don't really think you can go wrong with either one. But, if you want to sit around comparing d**k sizes and showing off peak horespower numbers, get the Procharger. If you want good street performance and slam your friends back in their seat, get the kenne-bell. The misconception is that all positive displacement blowers are the same. The twin screw blowers are 10 times better than the roots (Eaton) type. Take a look at the new Saleen S281-E It only makes 425hp, but does 11 sec 1/4 mile times (MM&FF Apr 2002). I know a lot out there with 500hp and getting the same times. Low end torque is what makes a street car "fun" to drive.
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1985 Mustang GT: 351W, Griggs, Baer, etc etc
Posts: 1214 | From: South Bay | Registered: Dec 2001
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v8302stangs
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Member # 530
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posted
High speed or track drag racing = get the centrifugal
Street, road race, just plain sexy power = kenne belle
at least that's what I gather
go to...
http://www.schwarzmann.com/
and look at his 95 with a kenne bell - he has all the real life 411 you would need kenne bell also looks a lot simpler and a lot easier to install than a centrifugal BASICALLY all you have to do is replace your upper intake.
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1995 GT 5.0
Mac Off-Road H pipe
00' Cobra R wheels
2 Chamber Flowmasters
3 MTX 10" subs
Posts: 137 | Registered: Nov 2001
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Chris_67_SC_408
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Member # 936
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but then if you want to make real power you have to tell people that you put the "blowzilla" with a "flowzilla" on it. How bout build a stroker and put a centrifugal on it, low end torque, top end boost.
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My sister runs 13s!!!
And your brother wants to eat her ass.
Posts: 716 | From: San Mateo, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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PunkINa5.SLOW
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Member # 10
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posted
Go for a ride in a Y or T trim car.
Double X car.
Or a D3R car and you will realize the power of them.
I dont see many motors over 500hp with anything but centrifugals on them.
the roots are cool but you cant loose with the tried and true.
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OUTTA THA DRAMA
R.I.P. MIKE STARKEY MY BABY BROTHER
12/8/77-5/17/03
Posts: 2495 | From: MTZ | Registered: Sep 2000
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93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
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posted
Or, get all the low-end torque you can handle PLUS all that upper rpm HP....with a Turbo.
Added sleeper bonus.
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www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
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FordPny
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Member # 510
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
with a Turbo.
Mmmm...TURBO
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Holla at yoo boooyyy
Posts: 2458 | From: San Jose CA | Registered: Oct 2001
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v8302stangs
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Member # 530
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
Or, get all the low-end torque you can handle PLUS all that upper rpm HP....with a Turbo.
Added sleeper bonus.
Ha ha but too much boost!
I remember this guy saying that he ran a 12.11 wih 350hp with a Kenne bell. I'd say that's not bad, for 1/4 vs hp I don't remember what his trap speed was, but I'm assuming it wasn't extremely high.
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1995 GT 5.0
Mac Off-Road H pipe
00' Cobra R wheels
2 Chamber Flowmasters
3 MTX 10" subs
Posts: 137 | Registered: Nov 2001
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9cobrasnake9
CAFords OG
Member # 575
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posted
If you still have the stock pre 99 heads I would go with the ken-bell. Max psi in high rpm's aren't going to net you the nubers on the top end that you would like to see. If I was you I would go with the ken bell and get the awesome low end grunt that positive displacement superchargers give you. Besides, grunt off the line is what your car needs the most. Just my 02
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96 Mystic Cobra
2011 F150 Raptor
Posts: 893 | From: Chico, Ca | Registered: Nov 2001
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Bill/APEX Motorsports
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Member # 636
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Hmmm....I wouldn't put "Kenne Bell" and "road racing" in the same sentence. They pump a LOT of heat into the engine and don't like turning high rpms. Basically, it's a truck blower, and you'd be putting it on a 7rpm motor. We've dynoed probably three or four DOHCs with KBs, and they barely wheezed 330-340rwhp. While the low rpm grunt was nice, they were severely lacking in building much high-rpm hp. We were able to make 410rwhp with a smaller pulley, water injection, larger injectors, bigger MAF, oval throttle body, and custom dyno-tuning.
If it were my car, a centrifugal blower would be my #1 choice.
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Bill Kaiser
APEX Motorsports
Santa Clara
www.apexmotorsports.com
408-562-1000
bill@apexmotorsports.com
Posts: 488 | From: Santa Clara, CA | Registered: Dec 2001
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v8302stangs
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Member # 530
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Bill/APEX Motorsports:
Hmmm....I wouldn't put "Kenne Bell" and "road racing" in the same sentence. They pump a LOT of heat into the engine and don't like turning high rpms. Basically, it's a truck blower, and you'd be putting it on a 7rpm motor. We've dynoed probably three or four DOHCs with KBs, and they barely wheezed 330-340rwhp. While the low rpm grunt was nice, they were severely lacking in building much high-rpm hp. We were able to make 410rwhp with a smaller pulley, water injection, larger injectors, bigger MAF, oval throttle body, and custom dyno-tuning.
If it were my car, a centrifugal blower would be my #1 choice.
Ah yeah good call - I didn't think about that. The other big thing about KBs do seem to be the increased intake temp. Either way, good torque from low rpm couldn't hurt on a track, eh?
Posts: 137 | Registered: Nov 2001
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Stimson
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Member # 51
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by v8302stangs:
quote:
Originally posted by Bill/APEX Motorsports:
Hmmm....I wouldn't put "Kenne Bell" and "road racing" in the same sentence. They pump a LOT of heat into the engine and don't like turning high rpms. Basically, it's a truck blower, and you'd be putting it on a 7rpm motor. We've dynoed probably three or four DOHCs with KBs, and they barely wheezed 330-340rwhp. While the low rpm grunt was nice, they were severely lacking in building much high-rpm hp. We were able to make 410rwhp with a smaller pulley, water injection, larger injectors, bigger MAF, oval throttle body, and custom dyno-tuning.
If it were my car, a centrifugal blower would be my #1 choice.
Ah yeah good call - I didn't think about that. The other big thing about KBs do seem to be the increased intake temp. Either way, good torque from low rpm couldn't hurt on a track, eh?
Take your car for a spin, bang 2nd, 3rd and 4th gear. See what your RPM drops to after each shift. I'll save you the time and tell you its a bit less than 4,000ish RPM. When "racing", power under 4K RPM doesn't matter. If you're drag racing, some real tires will keep you around 4Kish RPM durring launch as well.
Bill brings up great points. I can verify the dyno numbers with my own eyes. I remember a black 4V cobra making about 350ish RWHP... a few cars later another Cobra got on the dyno with a similar setup, but a centrifical... knocked out 60 more RWHP. Stop light, drag strip or road course, the two cars won't be in the same zip code if they raced ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
I love the KB crowd. They have about four owners with web pages up running decent times. The other several thousand KB owners are online 24hours a day posting the links to these 4 guys and talking about low RPM this and streetable that since their car own KB car is ... pinging on the street, over heating on the road course and getting spanked by every centrifical blower car at the drag strip.
jok3r- When you get your KB kit on, you have to race a Vortech/ATI/NOVI GT with a similar setup. Don't forget your KB's reciept. You'll need it for a refund Don't fall for BS magazine adds.
[ April 20, 2002, 01:10 AM: Message edited by: st5150 ]
Posts: 2373 | Registered: Jun 2000
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White02GT
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Member # 611
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posted
What kind of numbers do turbo chargers add? If I were to put a stage 1 TDC kit on my car, what kind of numbers would it put out compared to a vortech s trim?
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2002 Mustang GT 13.54 @ 102
"You can't out smart a smartass" Eminem
Posts: 1984 | From: Mountain View, Ca | Registered: Dec 2001
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Stimson
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Member # 51
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 95Camaro:
What kind of numbers do turbo chargers add? If I were to put a stage 1 TDC kit on my car, what kind of numbers would it put out compared to a vortech s trim?
The S trim is cheaper, easier to install and maintain (change plugs, ect) and can already make enough power to out-do what the returnless fuel system on your car can keep up with.
Posts: 2373 | Registered: Jun 2000
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Kevin99GT
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Member # 272
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posted
Hahaha ... great thread.
And don't forget guys, the quick solution to your low-end "problem" (if you wanna call it that), is a nice set of gears matched with your centri. Getting to max boost will be quick and painless with 4.10s or 4.30s on a Cobra (okay, 4.30s might be too much, depending on how hard core you wanna go) -- but you'll be reaping the benefits of multiplied torque plus much higher power numbers you'll get out of a vortech or procharger in the first place.
P1-SC Prochargers on a 4.6 still scare the crap outta me though. Too many *BOOM!*'s with the oiling issue that they've been claiming to have fixed for over a year now .... I'd go Vortech.
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• 2003 Honda Accord EX V6
• 2000 Suzuki SV650
• 1999 Chrome Yellow Mustang GT - SOLD
Posts: 185 | From: San Rafael, CA | Registered: May 2001
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Stimson
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Member # 51
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kevin99GT:
Hahaha ... great thread.
And don't forget guys, the quick solution to your low-end "problem" (if you wanna call it that), is a nice set of gears matched with your centri. Getting to max boost will be quick and painless with 4.10s or 4.30s on a Cobra (okay, 4.30s might be too much, depending on how hard core you wanna go) -- but you'll be reaping the benefits of multiplied torque plus much higher power numbers you'll get out of a vortech or procharger in the first place.
P1-SC Prochargers on a 4.6 still scare the crap outta me though. Too many *BOOM!*'s with the oiling issue that they've been claiming to have fixed for over a year now .... I'd go Vortech.
Well said! Actually doing the math, 4.30's + S-Trim on a 4.6L cobra is just right... 120 MPH at 7,000 RPM at the top of 4th gear.... its the most optimal gear for the best ET with 26 inch tires.
I guess this post can be summed up this way:
KB's sound good in magazines and web pages, but on the street and on the track you'll never see them do anything impressive except "feeling" fast.
Posts: 2373 | Registered: Jun 2000
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93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
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posted
At the track last night there was a guy with an 01 GT. Had a Vortec without intercooler/aftercooler running 118mph UNTUNED!. All the runs I saw were sweet. Lowest MPH beeing 115.9. Slap on an intercooler & get that thing tuned & low 11's are in the future with 120+ time slips.
There are only a few modulars running the TDC kits. For $5K they seem to be getting about the same HP as blower setups. The difference is torque. How many modular blower combo's out there put down significantly more torque than HP? The turbo cars do. Like Sawson said, at the track, the difference would be minimal since RPM should be up behond 4K.
Price wise there's also not much difference. A fully setup car with a Vortec, fuel system, intercooler, mass-air, tuning, etc. Is going to be about the same price as any given turbo kit. The difference being most Turbo kits come with the cost of some of these things built in. I don't know of any kit out there that doesn't come with an intercooler & fuel system.
IMO, it comes down to preference.
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www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
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Mikal
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Member # 652
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posted
I have had both. if you want, email me.
-Mike
whipplecharged5o@aol.com
Posts: 57 | Registered: Dec 2001
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v8302stangs
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Member # 530
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posted
What does the boost curve on a centrifugal look like when it is intercooled vs. non intercooled?
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1995 GT 5.0
Mac Off-Road H pipe
00' Cobra R wheels
2 Chamber Flowmasters
3 MTX 10" subs
Posts: 137 | Registered: Nov 2001
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PunkINa5.SLOW
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Member # 10
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posted
There is a Spetter tuned TDC 4.6 2V running an auto and it went 10.8s with a stock lonblock intake etc
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OUTTA THA DRAMA
R.I.P. MIKE STARKEY MY BABY BROTHER
12/8/77-5/17/03
Posts: 2495 | From: MTZ | Registered: Sep 2000
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