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Author
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Topic: Sacramento's 05 darkhorse gets an ON3 TURBO!!!
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Sarge
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Member # 11562
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So a lot of people have seen my mustang around town and know my car. This thread isnt just about my car, this thread is also about a small, not so well known turbo manufacturer known as On3performance. Everyones heard of the turbonetics and hellion turbo kits for the sn197, but those both range between $4500 and $5200 for their BASE kits. On3's base kit for the sn197 is $1900 as shown here http://www.on3performance.com/ThreeV.aspx
They also carry kits for from what I can tell every mustang version from 86 FI and up as well as some interesting fox body variants.
The total I spent was just shy of $2900 but I bought a slightly upgraded kit. on top of their base kit, I ordered the upgraded 67mm ball bearing turbo, 42 lb bosch fuel injectors, sct maf, and the fuel rail adapters for the injectors. Now I've had the turbo inspected by one of my instructors at UTI and he said he was impressed on the deal I got and said the turbo would be good for what im looking for.
I'm building my car for auto cross racing but seeing as how its my only means of transportation, I also need to keep it reliable. Even if I had another car, I'd still probably prefer to drive this one just because of what I went through to get it. A few people have raised their eyebrows when I said I'm going for autocross and using a turbo. Everyone asks why dont I just use an SC. Heres my experience with SC's, while yes, boost for boost turbos do make more hp and are easier to alter the boost levels on, the difference isnt enough to persuade me either way. Heres why I chose turbo; 1: I got a brand new, un-used, more complete, forced induction kit for less this way, than ANY supercharger kit, cetrifugal, roots or twin screw that I could find anywhere.
The main reason is because with just bolt on's and a mild custom tune I made using my diablo predator, I made 312 HP. I have PLENTY of natural hp, only thing I could have used a lil help in is the straight away and thats where the whistling wonder comes in.
Now if you were paying attention to the componants I said I have, youll notice 2 major things are missing; the fuel pump and the tune.
Now I started my article about this build on another mustang forum where I was introduced to a company called S&H performance that sells a Welbro fuel pump for sn197's that only costs around $300 but pushes out 342lb/hr! thats more than the GT500 double fuel pump for $700 or any other BAP (boost a pump) options!
Now for the tune issue. My first choice was AED performance because theyre the only company I know of in the local area that specializes in mustangs and has the capability of tuning so I called Sean and Drew. This was met with TOTAL disapointment. Drew straight turned it down without a second thought. Sean refused the oportunity with a statement I recall of, "every turbo mustang I've seen around here blows up." Now I understand the issue of liability but when it comes to tuning cars, unless there is a fatal mistake that can be proven was caused by the tune itself, tuners should hold no accountability for the malfunction. I offered a legally binding document pretty much stating this but this was met by more disapointment. Now obviously this left me with a sour taste in my mouth with those 2. Anyway this left me searching for another option. One of my coworkers at Future Ford of Roseville turned me on to Forced Fed performance. When I called, they not only accepted my offer, they seemed lagitimately enthusiastic about my project and wanting to tune it! Im pretty excited about this and seeing what the results are. The only unfortunate news I got from FFP was that they use SCT tuning... crap now I gotta switch to the dark side... I would love to buy the ITSX but due to the fact I only have $1000 available right now, i cant afford one but hopefully I can manage something. I have pictures up at this link of the car and the kit!
http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/2005-2010/276922-2005-mustang-gt-gets-on3performance-turbo.html
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HP 05 Stang GT with *your signiture is too long* worth of mods...
Sincerely, Sarge
Posts: 88 | From: Sacramento | Registered: Jan 2012
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75 chevy
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Member # 6717
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posted
a la verga!
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2009 prius
1975 monza
Posts: 1917 | From: california | Registered: Apr 2006
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racsirx
CAFords OG
Member # 1710
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posted
Two things I wouldn't do, On3 turbo kit and Forced Fed for tuning.
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88 Saleen #564
88 GT 331 NOVI2000
88 Coupe TURBO 9.75@142
95 Cobra R #75-SOLD
06 F250
13 BMW AH3
17 GT350 #5556
GOD'S NOT DEAD
Posts: 20750 | From: Concord & Pittsburg, CA | Registered: Aug 2002
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JohnB
Tech Moderator
Member # 969
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posted
Let us know what combo you're going with for your new shortblock.
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1965 Shelby Cobra
1993 Cobra
2012 F150 Raptor
2020 GT500
Posts: 6523 | From: Orlando FL/Redding CA | Registered: Mar 2002
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fam_lace
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Member # 8565
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posted
Ha ha damn bro I didn't know u where on here its Lacy from truck brakes lol i wanna see that car on the track in action glw build
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rip matt i love u cuz
351w h/c/I street car
Posts: 776 | From: dont trip | Registered: Aug 2008
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68gtscode
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Member # 8679
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
I only have $1000 available right now
This just made me laugh out loud... no wonder Drew and Shaun wouldn't touch your car with a 10 foot pole- I wouldn't either!
Posts: 293 | From: NM (505) | Registered: Oct 2008
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fam_lace
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Member # 8565
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posted
Force fed is a good shop and they are very informative and there coo people too. Me and my buddy went there to get his Camaro tuned and i noticed the mustangs so i started talking to the tuner he really knows his shit
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rip matt i love u cuz
351w h/c/I street car
Posts: 776 | From: dont trip | Registered: Aug 2008
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FRC_Kid
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Member # 8940
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 68gtscode:
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
I only have $1000 available right now
This just made me laugh out loud... no wonder Drew and Shaun wouldn't touch your car with a 10 foot pole- I wouldn't either!
He states he only has that amount of money left over for tuning... AED doesn't charge $1000 for a tune. Just face the facts, your a groupie and they turn down people. I know countless people that have been turned away or told their set up wouldn't work. Only to go somewhere else and get a tune with no prob.
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Pretend Racecar Driver- C5 FRC
Ford, GM, & Dodge is what I'm all about
Posts: 2578 | From: All over the Peninsula | Registered: Feb 2009
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68gtscode
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Member # 8679
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by cali95gt:
quote:
Originally posted by 68gtscode:
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
I only have $1000 available right now
This just made me laugh out loud... no wonder Drew and Shaun wouldn't touch your car with a 10 foot pole- I wouldn't either!
He states he only has that amount of money left over for tuning... AED doesn't charge $1000 for a tune. Just face the facts, your a groupie and they turn down people. I know countless people that have been turned away or told their set up wouldn't work. Only to go somewhere else and get a tune with no prob.
So the OP has $1,000 and is trying to build a budget "whistling wonder." He has no problem coming on a public forum to bad mouth a shop before he pays them any money... Imagine what he'll do when he blows up his engine and is faced with an engine build. AED generally operates at capacity, meaning they don't need to take every job that comes through the door. There is something in business called "risk management", and I'd say AED is pretty good at it. If there are lots of other shops out there that can tune this budget build, the OP should take his car there and make a positive post about it- not bad mouth a shop he has never even used before.
Posts: 293 | From: NM (505) | Registered: Oct 2008
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93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
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posted
No offense to anybody or their car/setup.
Doesn't come down to 'deep pockets' or $$$ at all.
We are simply VERY picky about the cars/setups we work on and tune. It doesn't mean it can't be done or that we *can't* do it, just means AED won't be doing it for you.
We simply can not handle the shear volume of work that would come if we did work on absolutely everything. As such we pick and choose the jobs we do. Turning away customers is sometimes better than a 3+ month wait for basic work and possibly lower quality work due to being 'over worked'. We are a small shop after all...
We very much appreciate FFP, AOP, TPS, Turbo50, etc for taking the jobs we don't.
In the end we are only one of a handful of NorCal shops dedicated to this 'hobby'. Our goal, like other shops, is not to make $$$, but to do the best job possible. Our goal is not to dominate thru quantity, it's quality we strive for.
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www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
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DEVERO2
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Member # 6155
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posted
[/qb][/QUOTE]So the OP has $1,000 and is trying to build a budget "whistling wonder." He has no problem coming on a public forum to bad mouth a shop before he pays them any money... Imagine what he'll do when he blows up his engine and is faced with an engine build. AED generally operates at capacity, meaning they don't need to take every job that comes through the door. There is something in business called "risk management", and I'd say AED is pretty good at it. If there are lots of other shops out there that can tune this budget build, the OP should take his car there and make a positive post about it- not bad mouth a shop he has never even used before. [/QB][/QUOTE]
^^^ This. Most can agree that AED does top notch work. They have worked very hard to earn that reputation and with the reputation comes business. Maybe they have an overfull schedule (they usually do) and that car just wont fit into their schedule. Having a successful business is a double edged sword. You want the business and you want to put an amazing finished products out there, but there are not enough hours in the day or spots in the shop to take on everything. I think that the ability to pick and chose projects has made them more respectable because you can guarantee that the product leaving that shop is of the highest quality and function.
Posts: 641 | From: sacramento | Registered: Oct 2005
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hidnn.o.s.
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Member # 1219
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
We very much appreciate FFP, AOP, TPS, Turbo50, etc for taking the jobs we don't.
So all of their work is from people who first go to you and you turn away ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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R.I.P. Willie G. You are missed on this forum
Posts: 15950 | Registered: Apr 2002
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Greasy
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Member # 5258
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
Our goal, like other shops, is not to make $$$, but to do the best job possible. Our goal is not to dominate thru quantity, it's quality we strive for.
Sometimes it's hard to find quality work from a shop, I've been to AED and you guys really do care about your customers and their cars. Keep up the good work guys.
I've been to some of the shops around the Dallas area here for tunes and have been like WTF is this? Some shotty work for top dollar and that pisses me off, I feel for the customer and the quality of work they're getting.
[ October 16, 2012, 12:57 PM: Message edited by: Greasy ]
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'93 Cobra-Coyote Powered
'03 DSG Cobra
'13 Dodge Cummins
'14 Rubicon X
Posts: 3272 | From: North Dallas | Registered: Jan 2005
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97cobra209
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Member # 11376
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posted
That sucks for aed and there rep! I thought they specialized in tuning mustangs!
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2011 GT/CS 5.0
Posts: 872 | From: Stockton | Registered: Oct 2011
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DEVERO2
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Member # 6155
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 97cobra209:
That sucks for aed and there rep! I thought they specialized in tuning mustangs!
There is more to tuning than putting the car on a dyno and hooking it to a computer, Especially since AED did not do the budget build. Too many variables for AED to deal with. He said he has 1000. what if he need something that the on3 kit didnt include and he didnt know he needed? It costs a lot of money to go fast and be reliable like the OP is asking for.
Posts: 641 | From: sacramento | Registered: Oct 2005
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93PONY
Mr. Valve Events
Member # 60
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by hidnn.o.s.:
quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:
We very much appreciate FFP, AOP, TPS, Turbo50, etc for taking the jobs we don't.
So all of their work is from people who first go to you and you turn away
That came out wrong.
Didn't mean to say it that way.
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www.advancedenginedevelopment.com
SCT dealer
Dynotuning
(916)715-7569
Posts: 4265 | From: Fair Oaks, CA | Registered: Nov 2000
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Y2K 281
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Member # 10132
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posted
ON3 Performance is crap!!! Some tuners are set in their ways regarding the types of setups they know work and what setups they prefer not to touch. You can even give Nat at AOP a call and get his opinion on the ON3 kits. They did one not that long ago and they had to do a ton of extra work to get everything to fit and not leak. I have said this before and will say it in the future, Turbo setups are the LAST thing you want to go cheap on. There are much more components you are dealing with that can cause issues. Blowers have seal issues, turbos have seal issues as well, along with oil drain issues, blowing oil, coking when not allowing to idle before shutting off, exhaust leaks causing drop in boost, wastegates leaking if cheap, boost creep from wastegate, etc. You really have to know your shit to set up a proper turbo, it isn't a matter of "oh I found this really cheap turbo kit, lets be a cheap ass and do it this way rather than researching the company". Have a look around...
Posts: 326 | Registered: Jul 2010
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Sarge
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Member # 11562
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posted
Alright, i didnt know there were people on here who blew bs outta proportion. but ill address that in a moment. I chose the on3 because it was affordable for me, and it offered exactly what i wanted unlike the hellion or turbonetics kits. Heres the shitty thing about most people; they typically dont go on a big scale to say when what they got works right. The mostly utilize things like the internet when stuff doesnt work right so here's how i stand, unless I've seen crappy results from stuff like tc kits or tunes, I'm not really going to doubt people. Now i dont care what you read on the internet, or heard from your buddy, if you weren't there or didn't see it, who are you to even make an opinion about their work? Now if something is brought up like, hey i had this done a while back by so and so and they blew my engine, then ok, id take that into consideration and thank you for the heads up but saying something sucks when you have no experience in this particular matter displays nothing but ignorance.
Now moving onto that 68 hero. Look guy, read carefully what i said before you misinterpret what i said and get all butt hurt guy. I didnt bad mouth AED. I said sean and drew turned me down and i was disappointed. The AED cars ive seen at the track were pretty amazing and I'll never take that away from them, but because of my personal experienc with them, at this time I have no interest utilizing their services at this point in time. I never said, hey everyone, AED sucks because they wouldn't tune my car and don't go there! That would be bad mouthing but hey, way to jump the gun. Anyway ill check this tonight and put in more details actually related to the car. Hopefully that'll be the end of this bs drama.
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HP 05 Stang GT with *your signiture is too long* worth of mods...
Sincerely, Sarge
Posts: 88 | From: Sacramento | Registered: Jan 2012
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adower
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Member # 5955
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by 68gtscode:
quote:
Originally posted by cali95gt:
quote:
Originally posted by 68gtscode:
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
I only have $1000 available right now
This just made me laugh out loud... no wonder Drew and Shaun wouldn't touch your car with a 10 foot pole- I wouldn't either!
He states he only has that amount of money left over for tuning... AED doesn't charge $1000 for a tune. Just face the facts, your a groupie and they turn down people. I know countless people that have been turned away or told their set up wouldn't work. Only to go somewhere else and get a tune with no prob.
So the OP has $1,000 and is trying to build a budget "whistling wonder." He has no problem coming on a public forum to bad mouth a shop before he pays them any money... Imagine what he'll do when he blows up his engine and is faced with an engine build. AED generally operates at capacity, meaning they don't need to take every job that comes through the door. There is something in business called "risk management", and I'd say AED is pretty good at it. If there are lots of other shops out there that can tune this budget build, the OP should take his car there and make a positive post about it- not bad mouth a shop he has never even used before.
Where did he bad mouth aed? Did you read his whole post?
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98 Cobra
Griggs
S Trim
HRE
Posts: 3327 | Registered: Aug 2005
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fam_lace
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Member # 8565
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posted
looks like some people misunderstood him he just wants his car tuned and was disappointed AED turned him down if u called and they turned u down u would be too so everybody dont have to jump in on the post like there is some need to defend AED cause its not RELAX LOL
[ October 16, 2012, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: fam_lace ]
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rip matt i love u cuz
351w h/c/I street car
Posts: 776 | From: dont trip | Registered: Aug 2008
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turbo50
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Member # 6700
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posted
ON3 sux, first hand experience.
Force fed sux, first hand experience.
I still tell everybody to give AED a shot see if they have time.
And you can't please everybody, first hand experience.
And my leg fuckin hurts! First hand experience.
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.........when was the last time YOU built something with YOUR own hands?
I offer quality sidework at reasonable prices. PM ME
Posts: 7606 | From: Discovery Bay, California | Registered: Apr 2006
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Greasy
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Member # 5258
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posted
^^^ That's a lot of experience!
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'93 Cobra-Coyote Powered
'03 DSG Cobra
'13 Dodge Cummins
'14 Rubicon X
Posts: 3272 | From: North Dallas | Registered: Jan 2005
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fast305s
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Member # 11897
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posted
Sarge.. I know you from uti. Infact iv dynoed your car before. Not impressive. And I know who you asked, and I know Mr le don't like on3 turbos.
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Built, not bought.
95 mustang gt
73 f-100
06 powerstroke
Posts: 154 | From: brentwood | Registered: Apr 2012
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LSFairmont
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Member # 6001
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by turbo50:
ON3 sux, first hand experience.
Force fed sux, first hand experience.
I still tell everybody to give AED a shot see if they have time.
And you can't please everybody, first hand experience.
And my leg fuckin hurts! First hand experience.
And because you said so, I believe you! ![[patriot]](graemlins/patriot.gif)
Posts: 3652 | From: the land of the lost | Registered: Sep 2005
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blkfoxbody89
5.O
Member # 8361
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posted
[ October 17, 2012, 12:16 AM: Message edited by: blkfoxbody89 ]
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'89 gt
'90 gt
Posts: 976 | From: sacramento | Registered: Apr 2008
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