Author
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Topic: wicked bog under 3k rpm and worst when cold
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
hi all my name is Mark. im 16 years old and have a 95 cobra with my dad. well we call it my car but its really our car and we call his dodge his but its also ours LOL
the mustang is kenne bell twin screwed at 6psi. the car is a cobra so it has the factory gt40 heads, a more aggressive cam i think, and little stuff like that. the engine has no internal mods. i dont even think the heads have ever been off the car.
every day when i start up i cant rev it without feathering the throttle because if i slowly, quickly, go hard into the throttle or just a little bit i get a bog. when driving and i get a bog it slows the car down like i stepped on the brake hard.
as far as i know i have all the equipment needed for the supercharger. msd ignition, 48lb injectors, fuel pump, fuel pressure regulator, dyno tune, high flow cats, ford racing headers, you name it we have it other than giggle gas and internal mods on the engine.
this bog scares me. i cant be confident in traffic that my car will have power when i need it. once i get above 3k i can drive like normal and hardly get another bog until i turn the car off.
a little history of the car is we have had trouble with detonation and have a vibration in the transmission right now.
any tips, tricks, theories or suggestions are welcome.
thanks
mark
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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50 Deep
Jockin 03 Cobras
Member # 6216
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posted
1) What's your fuel pressure set @? 2) What size fuel pump are you running? 3) What size/brand Maf? 4) have you pulled the plugs to see if its lean?
Sounds like your not getting enough fuel when you first step on the gas. Hook up a fuel pressure guage to the car and fire it up. See how the pressure is at idle and what it drops to once you rev it. If all that checks out I might look @ the maf.
If all else fails put it on a dyno so you can see your air fuel
-------------------- Signature Wheel Ford Representative Email: Terrance@Signaturewheel.com Instagram: @Signature_Wheel_Mustang Web: www.SignatureWheel.com
Posts: 6043 | From: sacramento | Registered: Nov 2005
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
does 30psi sound right?? i have a holley 255l in tank pump and the tuner set it up so when the boost kicks in it also increases the fuel pressure..
i pulled a plug but i have no flaming idea what the hell im looking for or at.. i think the mas air flow is stock but i dont know...
does anyone know if my 95 cobra has a OBDII diagnostic connector or OBD?
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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2BlueGeeTees
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Member # 4702
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posted
Google how to read spark plugs. You will find pictures and descriptions and you can match it up to your spark plug and see what you have. 30lb of fuel pressure is kinda low. Was this checked with the vacuum disconnected? Was the stock maf cal'd for 48# injectors? Also why in gods green earth would you he using a stock maf. Your car is an obd 1. From your discription it does sound like a fuel problem but maybe some greater detail as to what your are using and what you have checked already.
Posts: 2316 | From: Vacaville | Registered: Jul 2004
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50 Deep
Jockin 03 Cobras
Member # 6216
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posted
your car is an OBD II
If you pull the plugs and they are white then the car is lean. They should be a bronze color, but not black.
Stock fuel pressure is 38-39psi. If your running 30psi then your car is starving for fuel!!!!! Be sure you check/adjust it with the car running but the vacuum line to the regulator disconnected. Id set it at 38 then go drive it. plug up your guage then Increase or decrease your fuel pressure in 2psi increments then go drive it again and see how it feels. If your tuner is adding fuel up top then you dont want to add to much so you dont end up running rich. but like i said your way below stock fuel pressure and forced induction cars always need more fuel.
If your running 48lb injectors you should defintely have an aftermarket MAF regulator 75mm or bigger. Unless the tuner used software to recalibrate the stock MAF sensor.
Who is your tuner?
-------------------- Signature Wheel Ford Representative Email: Terrance@Signaturewheel.com Instagram: @Signature_Wheel_Mustang Web: www.SignatureWheel.com
Posts: 6043 | From: sacramento | Registered: Nov 2005
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
not too sure on the maf sensor.. whatever it is jhon b has seen it and said its okay for me so i took his word.. the car was tuned with the injectors and whatnot.. i measure my fuel pressure by looking at the gauge on my dash.
i have no idea what precisely my fuel pressure is.. im sure it is 30 at minimum..
all the spark plug charts ive seen arent for supercharged applications.. i have a general idea on how to read 2 stroke plugs but not too sure how much carries over to 4 stroke. if a 2 stroke plug looked like my mustang plug i would say too lean, not enough oil and too hot.. thats a 2 stroke though.
ive checked my right foot and it says something is wrong.. other than a new fuel filter and a clean air filter nothing.. i will say that its getting progressively worse. tonight ill check the cap and rotor, order new spark plugs and have the oil changed when i have the plugs put in.. should i take any other actions or skip something or do something?
the most puzzling thing is i can be on the floor from 3200rpm to the rev limiter without any trouble.. if i clutch and let the engine free rev up to 4k then continue driving the bog goes away.. i can hear fuel burning in the pipes when i do that then it runs better.
btw i had a mega backfire once that shut the engine down, the car was run hard by its previous owner to the point the drive shaft snapped and the ring and pinion exploded... i dont know if that history has anything to do with my problems but it might.
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
quote: Originally posted by 50 Deep: your car is an OBD II
If you pull the plugs and they are white then the car is lean. They should be a bronze color, but not black.
Stock fuel pressure is 38-39psi. If your running 30psi then your car is starving for fuel!!!!! Be sure you check/adjust it with the car running but the vacuum line to the regulator disconnected. Id set it at 38 then go drive it. plug up your guage then Increase or decrease your fuel pressure in 2psi increments then go drive it again and see how it feels. If your tuner is adding fuel up top then you dont want to add to much so you dont end up running rich. but like i said your way below stock fuel pressure and forced induction cars always need more fuel.
If your running 48lb injectors you should defintely have an aftermarket MAF regulator 75mm or bigger. Unless the tuner used software to recalibrate the stock MAF sensor.
Who is your tuner?
daniel at nexgen auto tuned me.. i dont know too much about the details.. ill check some things when i get home.. ill keep the fuel pressure in mind.
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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2BlueGeeTees
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Member # 4702
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T is right it's obd 2 I misread thought u had 93 cobra. Are you sure what your looking at is a FUEL PRESSURE GUAGE? If so you should be getting a good reading. As far as reading the plugs, supercharged or not you can read the color and characteristics of it and tell rich, lean, or good. Also, and no disrespect but there isn't one 16 year old kid on this planet that should be in a s/c mustang. DANGER. What color is it and what town so I can watch out for you. I know how I drove my lightly modded mustang at that age. Be careful dude.
Posts: 2316 | From: Vacaville | Registered: Jul 2004
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50 Deep
Jockin 03 Cobras
Member # 6216
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If john b said it was good then i would take his word for it also. he assembled my last motor.
However if your tuner is adding fuel up top then that should explain why the car runs better past a certain RPM. simply because it has mor fuel. The hardest part about tuning is getting the off idle to mid range power in perfect balance so its driveable. the top end tuning really isnt where most of the work is needed. If your fuel pressure really is set at a base setting of 30psi then i can almost guarantee bumping up the fuel pressure will make your car feel completely different.
You should have a dyno graph that shows your air fuel right? post that up if you have it
-------------------- Signature Wheel Ford Representative Email: Terrance@Signaturewheel.com Instagram: @Signature_Wheel_Mustang Web: www.SignatureWheel.com
Posts: 6043 | From: sacramento | Registered: Nov 2005
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
quote: Originally posted by 50 Deep: If john b said it was good then i would take his word for it also. he assembled my last motor.
However if your tuner is adding fuel up top then that should explain why the car runs better past a certain RPM. simply because it has mor fuel. The hardest part about tuning is getting the off idle to mid range power in perfect balance so its driveable. the top end tuning really isnt where most of the work is needed. If your fuel pressure really is set at a base setting of 30psi then i can almost guarantee bumping up the fuel pressure will make your car feel completely different.
You should have a dyno graph that shows your air fuel right? post that up if you have it
i dont know what the base pressure is for me.. i know it says 30 and 40 on the dial and i think the needle points somewhere inbetween.. for sure not lower than 30 but im also fairly sure its not higher than 40..
i have no idea how to tune a car other than give it the right air fuel mix and a good timing.. isnt that about it?
my cars performance parts havent changed motor related since the tune.. but the car has problems that only increase with time.. thats whats leading me to think its a wear part and not an issue such as fuel pressure or timing.. is timing adjusted manually with the distributor in these cars or by a computer? i have the full msd setup and am wondering because if its a manual adjustment then my vibration could have shaken the timing around..
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
quote: Originally posted by 707vibrantcobra93: T is right it's obd 2 I misread thought u had 93 cobra. Are you sure what your looking at is a FUEL PRESSURE GUAGE? If so you should be getting a good reading. As far as reading the plugs, supercharged or not you can read the color and characteristics of it and tell rich, lean, or good. Also, and no disrespect but there isn't one 16 year old kid on this planet that should be in a s/c mustang. DANGER. What color is it and what town so I can watch out for you. I know how I drove my lightly modded mustang at that age. Be careful dude.
ha yea its an auto meter fuel pressure guage. then im lean as phaq on my plug...
not to argue with you but im in a rush to get my motor issues in check so i can hit the track on may 26th.. i race on the track, have a sportscar on the street. kinda like a lady on the street but a freak in the bed the only time im past 1/4 throttle on the street is when im trying to figure out why the hell the motor doesnt run right. ive driven that car over 20k miles and never been pulled over.. i like to think that ricers have to show off on the street and i try to hold myself to standards above that.. i did play with a fararri once.. that was fun
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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50 Deep
Jockin 03 Cobras
Member # 6216
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posted
Most applications can be tuned fairly well with just timing and fuel. Base Timing is set by advancing or retarding the distributor. However on blown applications im sure your tune pulls timing up top as boost is increased. I have played around with adjusting stuff after my tune was done and realized it just throws shit off even worse. The MSD box could be fudging up your spark but tyou need to test it. You need to troubleshoot and eliminate problem areas. Start with your fuel since its easiest.
Honestly your best bet would be to take your car back to the shop that tuned it so they can strap it down, datalogg it and make any necessary correctons.
-------------------- Signature Wheel Ford Representative Email: Terrance@Signaturewheel.com Instagram: @Signature_Wheel_Mustang Web: www.SignatureWheel.com
Posts: 6043 | From: sacramento | Registered: Nov 2005
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
alright guys some news here.. at idle, 32psi, under load 36psi max, at speed with foot off the gas is 30psi.. how do i increase the fuel pressure? can i do it at home?
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
quote: Originally posted by SCCA SM: alright guys some news here.. at idle, 32psi, under load 36psi max, at speed with foot off the gas is 30psi.. how do i increase the fuel pressure? can i do it at home?
alright some damn good news here
stuck my head under the hood, was trying to listen to what was wrong while revving the engine from under the hood and i thought "wait a minute.. there are supposed to be 2 wires attached to this." sure enough a linkage had popped off.. its running much better but not 100% id say 75%
fuel pressure went up to 34psi idle, 32psi off the gas and 44psi at WOT.. red shelby gt500 on 101 meet a white cobra today? if your reading this i could have smoked you but that was a speed trap and much more than 68 is asking for a ticket..
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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JohnB
Tech Moderator
Member # 969
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posted
As stated before, the car NEEDS a re-tune. And a transmission...
-------------------- 1965 Shelby Cobra 1993 Cobra 2012 F150 Raptor 2020 GT500
Posts: 6525 | From: Orlando FL/Redding CA | Registered: Mar 2002
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SCCA SM
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Member # 9758
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posted
yep im at that conclusion now.. cant remember where you said to take it for a tune. aed?
thanks jhon. can i ship the car with a stack of money in it to you to fix it?? LOL
Posts: 58 | From: Bay Area. sleep in 415 area live in the bay area ;) | Registered: Jan 2010
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