Infineon Drags on 2/20 - Northern California Ford Owners

This is topic Infineon Drags on 2/20 in forum Drag Racing at Northern California Ford Owners .

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://californiafords.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=001365

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

Is anyone going? Their calendar says bracket drags on that day. I was gonna go to Sacramento on 2/18 but it looks like rain...

What's the fastest you can go in the Trophy class?

[ February 16, 2006, 11:31 PM: Message edited by: twisted54 ]

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

trophy has no limit. sportsman is 12.0 or 11.99
i'll be there for sure. [patriot]

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

Cool so what time should I get there and when do the trial runs start / eliminations?

I'm looking forward to going. It'll be my first time and 1st successful time with the 150 shot hopefully.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

be there as soon as they open or earlier. we leave my house at 700 and are there by 8am.
do you have a window swtich?

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

Cool...I'll plan on leaving at 7am too then.

Yep I have a window switch and the WOT switch. They seem to be working fine together.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

how did you wire it? could you look at my post on the tech section? we can't get my friends window switch to work.. please.
Cause then i'll do mine..
There are graphs on that other post.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

http://www.californiafords.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=013308
link,. thanks

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

quote:
Originally posted by twisted54:
Cool...I'll plan on leaving at 7am too then.

Yep I have a window switch and the WOT switch. They seem to be working fine together.

where will you be coming from? we go 92 880 .. if you are around there we can cruise together..

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jmir018:

quote:
Originally posted by twisted54:
Cool...I'll plan on leaving at 7am too then.

Yep I have a window switch and the WOT switch. They seem to be working fine together.
where will you be coming from? we go 92 880 .. if you are around there we can cruise together..

I'm coming from Concord so I go 680 N to 80 E to 37, etc.

The wiring is really easy:

Window switch wires:
white / tach terminal
black / chassis ground
red / + 12v
yellow goes to the ground wire on your relay so essentially, the window switch will act as the ground for your nitrous relay and the nitrous relay ground wire will no longer go to the chassis. That's it.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

that's how wwe have it set up!!
he does not have a relay.. so we took the cable that was grouding the solenoids and connected them to the yellow wire.. nothign is happening..

what do u think could be wrong with his?
Should we connect the yellow to the ground of his wot swtich?

on the other hand , I have a relay.. so just look for the ground wire from the relay? that shouldn't be hard at all?

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jmir018:
that's how wwe have it set up!!
he does not have a relay.. so we took the cable that was grouding the solenoids and connected them to the yellow wire.. nothign is happening..

what do u think could be wrong with his?
Should we connect the yellow to the ground of his wot swtich?

on the other hand , I have a relay.. so just look for the ground wire from the relay? that shouldn't be hard at all?

call me on my cell 415-748-2127 Tony

Posted by losbadgts (Member # 4394) on :

ok the car that Jmir018 was talking about is mine, but the only difference is that i have a 2000 and i need a tach adapter , now we did everything did it said to do with the tach adacter but still no luck

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

I've never used a tach adapter but I guess it should work...you're testing on the road right? Cause you won't be able to hear the solenoids clicking with the window switch connected while doing the car off test...ie arming the system and tapping the wot switch to activate.

What I did was was hooked everything up normal minus the window switch to make sure I could hear the solenoids clicking. Then I added the window switch setup and then took it for a test drive to see if it worked.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

quote:
Originally posted by twisted54:
I've never used a tach adapter but I guess it should work...you're testing on the road right? Cause you won't be able to hear the solenoids clicking with the window switch connected while doing the car off test...ie arming the system and tapping the wot switch to activate.

What I did was was hooked everything up normal minus the window switch to make sure I could hear the solenoids clicking. Then I added the window switch setup and then took it for a test drive to see if it worked.

yeah the system was supposebly working fine before we did the window switch.
all the tach adapter does is give us the tach terminal that's connected to the white wire on the msd window switch.
we tested it with nitrous on the road.

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

Are you sure the tach adapter is working right? My setup wasn't working right with my Crane ignition and the way I was connecting the white wire. It only started working good with the addition of the 6AL with the tach terminal.

Try your setup and see if it works...it should.

Posted by losbadgts (Member # 4394) on :

how do we know if the tach adapter is working right? i guess the only thing left to do is make sure we are getting power and the grounds are ok, we really didn't have a whole lot of time yesterday, so tomorrow night we are going to try to test everything

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

Yeah just make sure the ground and power is good... Have you been able to find any diagrams on MSD's website that show the window switches being used with a tach adapter?

Posted by losbadgts (Member # 4394) on :

yea my friend has them, we will go over the setup tomorrow, thank u and if we need any help we will call u [Big Grin]

[ February 17, 2006, 01:45 AM: Message edited by: losbadgts ]

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

no problem...sorry I couldn't help more.

Good luck with it and I'll probably see you guys on Sunday.

Posted by Luke87GT (Member # 21) on :

question...

The last time I was out there they were not putting water in the burnout box. What's the deal with that?

I cannot put my clutch thru 2nd gear burnouts on slicks with no water.

Any thoughts?

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

twisted54,
i just realized that my relay does not have a wire that goes to ground [Confused]

this is the way it's set up.
The system works fine as it is right now.. . but i want the safety of the window swtich cause i tend to miss gears more often than i'd like to admit.

*Terminal 30 is connected to the battery with 30 amp fuse.
*Terminal 86 to our arming toggle switch under the dash.
*Terminal 85 connects to the positive side of the WOT switch.
*Terminal 87 is wired to the nitrous and fuel solenoids.

pd: this image was found on the following website(http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2004/09/NitrousWorks/index3.php) i don't know if it has copy rights or not.. so i'm just making a note of that.

[ February 17, 2006, 10:52 PM: Message edited by: Jmir018 ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jmir018:
twisted54,
i just realized that my relay does not have a wire that goes to ground
this is the way it's set up.
The system works fine as it is right now.. . but i want the safety of the window swtich cause i tend to miss gears more often than i'd like to admit.

*Terminal 30 is connected to the battery with 30 amp fuse.
*Terminal 85 to our arming toggle switch under the dash.
*Terminal 86 connects to the positive side of the WOT switch.
*Terminal 87 is wired to the nitrous and fuel solenoids.

pd: this image was found on the following website(http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2004/09/NitrousWorks/index3.php) i don't know if it has copy rights or not.. so i'm just making a note of that.

Your relay must be grounded you wired it up wrong. 85 should be ground and not your toggle switch. As it sits now, your toggle switch will not receive any power it will never turn anything on. How do you want it to work? Just let me know and I can tell you how to wire it up. I'm just looking at what you have right now and from what it seems, you want to go with a toggle that arms the system and a wot switch that will activate the nos, correct? If so let me know and I can tell you how to wire it. But 85 is definitely ground! (PS you can use 86 as a ground as long as you have 85 as a 12v input, but standard is 85 ground and 86 12v input)

If your window switch provides a wire for ground, then that is the wire you connect to the ground of your nos solenoids instead of grounding them directly. Another way would be to use the widow switch ground wire and connect this to the 85 of the relay instead of grounding 85 directly. Both ways will work. Basically the window switch will provide a ground at a desired rpm and this will finalize the loop and complete the circuitry in order for your nos to work.

[ February 17, 2006, 10:11 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

There's several ways to do a nos system with arming switch and wot switch. I'll just post up one way to prevent too much confusion. If you need help with it another way just let me know. Your diagrams with the "negative solenoid" wire makes me think that this is how the manufacturers want you to wire in the window switch. This will be wired in order from left to right.

1. 12v ignition to arming switch to 86 of the relay. Your arming switch should also have a ground which is there for the lighting circuitry when its armed. You should have 3 terminals on the arming switch. One goes to 12v ignition, one goes to 86 of relay and the last goes directly to ground. Terminals should be labeled on the arming switch.

2. 85 of relay to wot switch to ground. One side of the wot switch goes to ground and the other side goes to 85 of the relay it.

3. 12v battery to FUSE to 30 of the relay

4. 87 of the relay to positive wire of nos/fuel solenoids. Negative wire of nos/fuel solenoids goes to the grounding wire from the window switch.

Again this is just one way to wire it there will be several different variations of the same thing and all will work fine.

[ February 17, 2006, 10:12 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

PS. Personally I like to connect the solenoid ground wires directly to ground and use the ground wire of 85 as a switched ground. There is less current in this wire because its only carrying a load to close the relay. Whereas, the ground side of the solenoids carry the current necessary to operate the solenoids and this current is much higher than the current used to close the relay. I'd rather be switching as low of a current load as possible. Therefore, I would wire the negative side of the solenoids directly to ground. Then I would go from 85 on relay to wot switch to window switch solenoid ground wire. But that's just me. Here's how I would wire it:

1. 12v ignition to arming switch to 86 of the relay. Your arming switch should also have a ground which is there for the lighting circuitry when its armed. You should have 3 terminals on the arming switch. One goes to 12v ignition, one goes to 86 of relay and the last goes directly to ground. Terminals should be labeled on the arming switch.

2. 85 of relay to wot switch to grounding wire from the window switch. One side of the wot switch goes to grounding wire from the window switch and the other side goes to 85 of the relay.

3. 12v battery to FUSE to 30 of the relay

4. 87 of the relay to positive wire of nos/fuel solenoids. Negative wire of nos/fuel solenoids directly to ground.

[ February 17, 2006, 10:03 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

PPS. I will not make any referece to a bus or a school teacher. But if this was someone else.......

[Razz]

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

dude. the system already worked as it was done before.

This is pretty much the set up i have.

i would totally redo my wiring, but the thing is working fine as it sat. i got this instructions from a very trustworthy site. [Wink]

[ February 17, 2006, 10:23 PM: Message edited by: Jmir018 ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

I thought you were having troubles with a window switch?

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

i haven't even installed the window switch. the toggle swith works fine.. from what i hear.. if you have it set up as in the graph i posted above, then the ground from the wot should be the one connected to the yellow wire..
pd, what do u think, on that graph none of the terminals go to ground.

[ February 17, 2006, 10:25 PM: Message edited by: Jmir018 ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

ummm dude that is EXACTLY how I wrote to wire it. I don't need a trustworty site.....I am the trustworthy site!

[ February 17, 2006, 10:26 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

quote:
Originally posted by cummins:
ummm dude that is EXACTLY how I wrote to wire it. I don't need a trustworty site.....I am the trustworthy site!

ha.. cool. thanks for the help. so the ground from the window switch should be low enough to be handled by the window switch?

you can't school me.. i'm the vicepresident of team cummins, remember? [Wink]

[ February 17, 2006, 10:29 PM: Message edited by: Jmir018 ]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

and if your system works then your "positive" side (like you wrote) of the wot switch must actually have continuity to ground when at wot. So it would not be very positive at all!

[ February 17, 2006, 10:35 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

hum.. wanna come over and rewire my system? [Wink]

what's your location?

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jmir018:
i haven't even installed the window switch. the toggle swith works fine.. from what i hear.. if you have it set up as in the graph i posted above, then the ground from the wot should be the one connected to the yellow wire..
pd, what do u think, on that graph none of the terminals go to ground.

See my above post where I laid out how I would do it. Here is what I wrote just in case you don't want to read it.

"85 of relay to wot switch to grounding wire from the window switch. One side of the wot switch goes to grounding wire from the window switch and the other side goes to 85 of the relay."

And here is what I wrote in regards to your grounding question:

"Basically the window switch will provide a ground at a desired rpm and this will finalize the loop and complete the circuitry in order for your nos to work."

So yes there appears to be no ground for the terminals but the window switch will provide the ground for these terminals when you reach that desired rpm

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

ok. i actually reread all your posts.
i have the set up you explained on your second post. with the solenoids connected straight to ground.. no ground on the relay.
85 does go to the wot. and then the ground from wot goes to yellow on the window switch , correct?

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

The confusion is that you mixed up 85 and 86 from "standard" practices and procedures. That is perfectly fine to do though just as long as one terminal goes to + and the other one goes to -. The relay knows no difference if you swap terminals. So for you, 86 is the grounding side and 85 is the positive side. Your 30 and 87 are correct. Let me reword what I wrote in accordance to how you have your system wired. That may be more helpful.

1. 12v ignition to arming switch to 85 of the relay. Your arming switch should also have a ground which is there for the lighting circuitry when its armed. You should have 3 terminals on the arming switch. One goes to 12v ignition, one goes to 85 of relay and the last goes directly to ground. Terminals should be labeled on the arming switch.

2. 86 of relay to wot switch to grounding wire from the window switch. One side of the wot switch goes to grounding wire from the window switch and the other side goes to 86 of the relay.

3. 12v battery to FUSE to 30 of the relay

4. 87 of the relay to positive wire of nos/fuel solenoids. Negative wire of nos/fuel solenoids directly to ground.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

i see what you are saying..
there was a confusion. i do have the 85 terminal going to the wot. and 86 going to the toggle switch.
i got them mixed up when i typed it first.

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

so.. who else is going to the track.. sorry to hijack this thread.

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

whoops double post

[ February 17, 2006, 11:02 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by Jmir018 (Member # 1414) on :

quote:
Originally posted by cummins:
Here's how I would wire it:

1. 12v ignition to arming switch to 86 of the relay. Your arming switch should also have a ground which is there for the lighting circuitry when its armed. You should have 3 terminals on the arming switch. One goes to 12v ignition, one goes to 86 of relay and the last goes directly to ground. Terminals should be labeled on the arming switch.

2. 85 of relay to wot switch to grounding wire from the window switch. One side of the wot switch goes to grounding wire from the window switch and the other side goes to 85 of the relay.

3. 12v battery to FUSE to 30 of the relay

4. 87 of the relay to positive wire of nos/fuel solenoids. Negative wire of nos/fuel solenoids directly to ground.

<<-- thanks, that's how i have it set up now. [patriot]

Posted by cummins (Member # 5931) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jmir018:
ok. i actually reread all your posts.
i have the set up you explained on your second post. with the solenoids connected straight to ground.. no ground on the relay.
85 does go to the wot. and then the ground from wot goes to yellow on the window switch , correct?

I only wrote the 1st way just because I looked at your diagram and you wrote [- solenoids] which made me think that you wanted to switch the grounds of the solenoid with the window switch. I don't like doing this. I wrote the 2nd way because this is how I prefer to do it.

And yes you are correct in what you said above the ground side of the wot switch will now go to the grounding wire (yellow) of the window switch.

When your window switch reaches its desired parameter it will ground that yellow wire internally and your nos will be activated. You don't see the ground in the diagram because its done internally in the window switch. You see how there is a regular ground wire (black) of the window switch that you must connect to a chasis for ground? Basically when you hit that certain rpm the yellow wire and the black chasis ground wire of the window switch will make contact internally in the window switch, thus the system ground and SPPPPPRRRAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY.

FnF baby! Nos button = OHHHHHH SHIIIIEEEETTTTTT!

[ February 17, 2006, 11:03 PM: Message edited by: cummins ]

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

is 2/20 brackets or tnt and do you think they'll say anything about not having padding on the rollcage?

[ February 18, 2006, 09:43 PM: Message edited by: twisted54 ]

Posted by sean04 (Member # 4863) on :

quote:
Originally posted by twisted54:
is 2/20 brackets or tnt and do you think they'll say anything about not having padding on the rollcage?

Probably, they are very strick there. They didnt let a friend of mine run because the insides of his front tires were close to bald.

Posted by two-gun kid (Member # 5891) on :

im prob going to be riding with one of my friends.

Posted by hidnn.o.s. (Member # 1219) on :

quote:
Originally posted by twisted54:
is 2/20 brackets or tnt and do you think they'll say anything about not having padding on the rollcage?

I was thinking they "most likely" won't stop you because of padding. .02

Goodluck everyone [patriot]

I'll be out there March 1st [burnout]

Posted by two-gun kid (Member # 5891) on :

anyone coming from the hayward area? trying to find out what time people are leaving.

Posted by twisted54 (Member # 1981) on :

I'm coming from 680 N to the Benicia Bridge to 80 and so on...I'll see you guys there.

Fueled by Ford Mustang Owners
on CaliforniaFords.com