quote:

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Originally posted by 70stang351w:
Taser should be first protocol 2 chances to listen then you get tased. Maybe cops first clip should be rubber rounds or bean bag rounds shits out of control

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quote:

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Originally posted by SIC9250:
Opinions?? Looks like an execution to me either way sad shit..

https://youtu.be/ypEN1ay5i78

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quote:

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Originally posted by SIC9250:
Opinions?? Looks like an execution to me either way sad shit..

https://youtu.be/ypEN1ay5i78

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quote:

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Originally posted by i:

quote:

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Originally posted by SIC9250:
Opinions?? Looks like an execution to me either way sad shit..

https://youtu.be/ypEN1ay5i78

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Holy shit, I just saw the end of the video when the cop shot that dude with the shot gun! Damn that is execution style! I skip the video earlier.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by SLOWBACK 67:
(True story from a few years ago)

2 cops on their patrol spotted a stolen car. They try and pull the car over. Doesn't happen. They get in a short chase and 2 young black males jump out of the car running in different directions. One cop went after one and the other officer chases the other suspect. Durring the run the suspect jumps a fence in front of the cop, cops jumps over and as he hits the ground the suspect reaches in his pocket..... The cops see's this and pulls out his gun telling the suspect to drop whatever he has.... The suspect decides to reach back into his pants and point the object back at the officer. The officer shoots the guy and discovers that the suspect was pulling his phone out of his pocket and pointing it at the officer..... These guys WANT to get shot and hope that they live so they can SUE the department. ( criminals even brag about it.)
Along with whatever officer was involved in civil court. All this shit being reported about cops going out hunting down blacks is preposterous. ZERO facts suport the medias claims that Blacks are being shot by cops at a higher rate then whites, hispanics, asians....

Rant over.

---

Good story, thanks for sharing! It would appear this idiot did something similar as far as reaching but I bet he didn't count on the body cameras to back up the officer's claim of reaching for something.

#1 Right off the bat the guy was speeding
#2 The guy won't pull over
We don't need to go to #3 yet because it would appear the guy is running from something. He could've committed armed robbery, a murder, rape, etc etc so of course the cops are on high alert.

They shot twice (I believe) and the guy is still reaching around towards his pockets. How many chances does this upstanding citizen need, so they took out the threat.

It could've ended with two shots and the guy living but as you can see the guy is either spun on drugs, suicidal or both to cost him his life. He would not comply with any demands the cops threw out a multitude of times.

Back in the day, officer's carried 357 revolvers to take care of business with one shot, now they have these little 9mm's to give you a chance to live.

I guess like someone said, its this "new generation" which I don't get. Entitlement, no accountability, you can't touch me attitude....WTF happened and how did it happen so quickly

[ 2016-07-21, 04:49 PM: Message edited by: 9cobra7 ]
 

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Posted by SVTGhoust (Member # 20) on :
 
moral of the story is...if the officer tells you to do something...do it, and you will live to fight whatever you want to fight in court.
 

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Posted by SLOWBACK 67 (Member # 6348) on :
 
Kids having kids. A few generations of rewarding single mothers with section 8, WIC, EBT and Medi cal..... Hasn't helped the situation either. Boys growing up without a father teaching them how to conduct themselves. Geting locked up becoming a burden to society.
Not trying to say all singles mothers can't do it. But our morals have changed so much over the decades. People want to beat their chest and say we have progressed sooo much in the last 50 years. But in some aspects we have taken a step backwards in the process. The War on drugs and Poverty haven't worked out. All we have done is spent trillions of dollars trying to FIX the Nations Problems. Americans need to quit expecting the Government to solve their problems. The less Government intervention in all our lives the better IMHO. Americans have lost/gave away their independence. It's just been taken so slow by the politicains that most haven't caught onto it yet!
 

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Posted by mikeP (Member # 4489) on :
 
@4:07 sounds like the young man says "dood I fucking hate my life, fuck it:.......+2 Suicide by cop..Cops did everything by the book. I think the last part where they kept bucking into him probably could have just jumped on him at that point.....
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by SIC9250:
Opinions?? Looks like an execution to me either way sad shit..

https://youtu.be/ypEN1ay5i78

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by SLOWBACK 67:
Kids having kids. A few generations of rewarding single mothers with section 8, WIC, EBT and Medi cal..... Hasn't helped the situation either. Boys growing up without a father teaching them how to conduct themselves. Geting locked up becoming a burden to society.
Not trying to say all singles mothers can't do it. But our morals have changed so much over the decades. People want to beat their chest and say we have progressed sooo much in the last 50 years. But in some aspects we have taken a step backwards in the process. The War on drugs and Poverty haven't worked out. All we have done is spent trillions of dollars trying to FIX the Nations Problems. Americans need to quit expecting the Government to solve their problems. The less Government intervention in all our lives the better IMHO. Americans have lost/gave away their independence. It's just been taken so slow by the politicains that most haven't caught onto it yet!

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Martinna:

quote:

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Originally posted by SIC9250:
Opinions?? Looks like an execution to me either way sad shit..

https://youtu.be/ypEN1ay5i78

---

The cops saw this young man, Dylan Noble of Fresno lay a little rubber while going around the corner in his loud V8 truck. That's why he was pulled over. Probably wasn't the first time he was hassled by police for having a loud V8. Maybe some of you can relate. The loss of life is sad. Those that know him say he was a good guy. Into things typical country guys are into. There was no need for the cold hearted cop to pump extra bullets into that young man's withering body. Your government is increasingly quick to use violence against not only other countries, but also against its citizens.

---

You need to get your facts straight. We are taking this particular shooting on a case by case basis ONLY! I hope what I just said sinks in for one moment.

He was pulled over because he drew attention to himself...PERIOD. He could've been driving a Prius; the V8 argument is null and void. He was driving in a reckless manner.

#1 Driving reckless through an intersection.
#2 Speeding down the road and the cops only caught him because of the red light down the road.
#3 Evading and not pulling over when take down lights/siren were issued.
#4 Not complying whatsoever to verbal commands.

At #3, this point it becomes a felony stop as you can see, guns were drawn while pulling him over and before the cops even got out of the car. They have no idea why he is doing this.

In this particular case, this kid made really stupid decisions which cost him his life. You just don't do this no matter how bad your day is because you know what...it just got a lot worse FOR NO REASON AT ALL.

Maybe this kid was a good kid, but you would never know that by how he ACTED ON CAMERA.
You ever heard of actions speak louder that words? Ever heard of do stupid things win stupid prizes? How about cause and affect?

I don't think you are stupid by any means and I think you are a reasonable person and I do understand many of the things you speak, as well as agree with some of it. In this case, I believe your argument is irrelevant.

It didn't have to turn out this way and I don't like watching the video at all but this is what many good police have to deal with. You can't have people running around just doing whatever they feel like when they feel like it. There needs to be some form of law and order too.
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
9cobra7--------- Thank you. I do not think we have a disagreement here. I agree with your above post. Yes, to me chirping your tires while going around a corner is a trivial and not a crime. Very easy to do in a V8 truck My only objection to the video was the cops pumping extra bullets into the young man's body after he was already shot several times. It seemed excessive. Maybe the young man could have survived. From what I've read and seen, the young man deserved deference if the actions that occurred were prompted by chirping the tires on his V8 truck. I wonder if this young man's punishment fit his "crime". I respect your opinion. It is very similar to mine.
 

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Posted by 9cobra7 (Member # 2812) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Martinna:
9cobra7--------- Thank you. I do not think we have a disagreement here. I agree with your above post. Yes, to me chirping your tires while going around a corner is a trivial and not a crime. Very easy to do in a V8 truck My only objection to the video was the cops pumping extra bullets into the young man's body after he was already shot several times. It seemed excessive. Maybe the young man could have survived. From what I've read and seen, the young man deserved deference if the actions that occurred were prompted by chirping the tires on his V8 truck. I wonder if this young man's punishment fit his "crime". I respect your opinion. It is very similar to mine.

---

You keep talking about chirping tires? You could throw gum out the window and still get stopped if that helps your thinking. They may have not stopped him for that but the kicker was driving at high rate of speed. That combo will get you noticed for sure.

Here's where things get interesting. Suppose this young man is looking for a trigger on some sort of exploding device that he is wearing which the cops can't see. Is that possible? Yes it is.

The suspect just keeps putting his hands down where they don't belong. Cops repeatedly yell to keep his hands up which the suspect will not do. They don't know what else to do since every officer wants to go home to his family at the end of the day. Do you want to go home everyday?

Things are insane in the world right now and police are on extreme alert for domestic/foreign terrorists and cannot take any chances! This guy was clearly not rational at the time of the incident, who knows why.

So I ask you this: Is it possible that all these innocent unarmed black people (that make the news everyday) aren't so innocent as they claim to be? My answer is perhaps.

BTW, I'm running for president in 2020

One other thing. We used to have some police officers on here but I think they know not to post anything anymore since everything they do now is monitored. Facebook posts, forums, emails etc are all under observation and you've seen people put things on the net which has gotten people fired, sued etc.
Would've loved to hear from some of those individuals on these matters

[ 2016-07-22, 06:35 PM: Message edited by: 9cobra7 ]
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
I'm sure they are all on the board still and still post. I don't think it's anybody's business who the cops are on the board at this point but I for one do know they are great people, love their mustangs and America. CaFords has the best cops!
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
The police are always watching groups like this. Sometimes they blend in, but always they lurk. Always on duty. Always snitching. You think they don't? They've been arresting people critizing cops online after the Dallas shootings. Do you still have your freedom of speech? At least this site isn't a government collaborator like apple, google, facebook, twitter, microsoft and the rest that always share all of your data with the government, so cops can arrest you for criticizing them online! Never say anything bad against the government using products from apple, google, facebook, twitter, and microsoft. They do not respect your freedom.


Some cops here probably know Noah Winchester, a rapist San Mateo & Sacramento cop that just got arrested for "kidnapping with intent to commit rape, rape, sexual penetration and oral copulation under color of authority, sexual battery, criminal threats, and forcible sex offenses." One of the girls was a minor

[ 2016-07-23, 02:54 AM: Message edited by: Martinna ]
 

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Posted by SLOWBACK 67 (Member # 6348) on :
 
^ Yes we do have fredom of speach and I am all for that. But the second you start talking about killing others based on their Race or Job or some other crazy reason, then the athorities should consider this as a serious matter.
We can be convicted of conspiracy to rob a bank , murder or kidnaping so that's why I believe these threats should be taken seriously.
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
The police come out to car shows with their families to show off their cars, they go to the track to race their cars, they jump on the forums to checkout what people are doing to their cars so they can do similar things to theirs. You know shit that maybe you should be doing instead of constantly hating on cops and worrying about them snitching which I'm not sure what type of snitching is even possible on a local car forum...
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
Law enforcement also shoots a black man with his hands up as he tries to help an autistic patient playing with a toy truck. There is a video of it if you click here.


Law enforcement also beats and bloodies up a 19 year old girl that's deaf, blind, paralyzed cancer patient returning from brain tumor treatment.


History shows it's inevitable for any country engaged in an endless War posture, that the war mentality, war tactics and war weaponry will be imported to its homeland to be used against its citizens.
 

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Posted by El Caballo (Member # 6355) on :
 
Whatever happened to bean bag rounds
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
El Caballo----- endless war is what happened Instead of bean bags, cops are asking Obama for permission to use grenade launchers against you!

I can't say this enough ------- History shows it's inevitable for any country engaged in an endless War posture, that the war mentality, war tactics and war weaponry will be imported to its homeland to be used against its citizens.

War posture --- check --- hostile attitude by cops, just turn on the news or dare rev your V8 in front of a cop. Just look at the bloodied deaf, blind, paralyzed cancer patient teen girl returning from brain tumor treatment.

War tactics ---- check --- cops snooping on your phones, all calls, texts, chats, emails recorded. Invasive surveillance.

War weaponry --- check --- cops using war weaponry, armored vehicles, even bombing suspects and asking to use grenade launchers against Americans!


Watching people getting shot after getting pulled over for chirping their truck tires, burned tail lights or with their hands up is not easy for me. The punishment does not fit the crime. This is not justice. Life is too valuable.

[ 2016-07-26, 02:19 AM: Message edited by: Martinna ]
 

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Posted by TR1 (Member # 296) on :
 
It was suicide by cop, plain and simple. He couldn't do it himself so he made someone else do it for him. Listen to the audio.
 

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Posted by 9cobra7 (Member # 2812) on :
 
I'm ready to give up on you at this point. You have clearly not understood what transpired in the video of the Fresno shooting incident. That kid took himself out! It doesn't matter how he got pulled over. He broke multiple laws and that is why he was pulled over. What don't you understand about this particular case??

You are clearly biased that all these police are out to get us for no reason. That hasn't happened yet...especially in this case.

Yes, there are cases of police overstepping boundaries but that Fresno shooting IS NOT ONE OF THEM!

You leave me bewildered and baffled at the lack of understanding and comprehension of what took place ON CAMERA Watching people getting shot after getting pulled over for chirping their truck tires, burned tail lights or with their hands up is not easy for me. The punishment does not fit the crime. This is not justice. Life is too valuable. [/QB][/QUOTE]

quote:

---

---

quote:

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Martinna:
El Caballo----- endless war is what happened Instead of bean bags, cops are asking Obama for permission to use grenade launchers against you!

I can't say this enough ------- History shows it's inevitable for any country engaged in an endless War posture, that the war mentality, war tactics and war weaponry will be imported to its homeland to be used against its citizens.

War posture --- check --- hostile attitude by cops, just turn on the news or dare rev your V8 in front of a cop. Just look at the bloodied deaf, blind, paralyzed cancer patient teen girl returning from brain tumor treatment.

War tactics ---- check --- cops snooping on your phones, all calls, texts, chats, emails recorded. Invasive surveillance.

War weaponry --- check --- cops using war weaponry, armored vehicles, even bombing suspects and asking to use grenade launchers against Americans!


Watching people getting shot after getting pulled over for chirping their truck tires, burned tail lights or with their hands up is not easy for me. The punishment does not fit the crime. This is not justice. Life is too valuable.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Martinna:
El Caballo----- endless war is what happened Instead of bean bags, cops are asking Obama for permission to use grenade launchers against you!

I can't say this enough ------- History shows it's inevitable for any country engaged in an endless War posture, that the war mentality, war tactics and war weaponry will be imported to its homeland to be used against its citizens.

War posture --- check --- hostile attitude by cops, just turn on the news or dare rev your V8 in front of a cop. Just look at the bloodied deaf, blind, paralyzed cancer patient teen girl returning from brain tumor treatment.

War tactics ---- check --- cops snooping on your phones, all calls, texts, chats, emails recorded. Invasive surveillance.

War weaponry --- check --- cops using war weaponry, armored vehicles, even bombing suspects and asking to use grenade launchers against Americans!


Watching people getting shot after getting pulled over for chirping their truck tires, burned tail lights or with their hands up is not easy for me. The punishment does not fit the crime. This is not justice. Life is too valuable.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sic70stang:
justified, moving on....

---

Hmm...very different point of view than what you just said above ^^^

You and Martinna might need to have lunch to figure this one out
 

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Posted by Blue92 (Member # 8789) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 9cobra7:

quote:

---

Originally posted by sic70stang:
justified, moving on....

---

Hmm...very different point of view than what you just said above ^^^

You and Martinna might need to have lunch to figure this one out

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Blue92:

quote:

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Originally posted by 9cobra7:

quote:

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Originally posted by sic70stang:
justified, moving on....

---

Hmm...very different point of view than what you just said above ^^^

You and Martinna might need to have lunch to figure this one out

---

Apparently you couldn't sense his sarcasm.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by sic70stang:
seriously they could of handled this differently... when my son is mad i tickle him and he ends up laughing. usually thats all is needed to change his attitude. these cops could of tickled him. i cant Fn believe they thought this kid ,who was hiding his hands behind his back, had a gun. dont police officers have training in mind reading?

PS> RIP MISS CLIO

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She just passed yesterday...thought we had Physics here i remember one of those cafords physics saying turbo50 would make good some day Call dem now for your free reading and dyno estimates
 

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Posted by DLo (Member # 6133) on :
 
Martinna, are you a Ron Paul supporter?
 

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Posted by sic70stang (Member # 4347) on :
 
Libertarian for life !
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
Hi DLo ------- I can't say I support 100% of anyone's positions. Politics should not be like football, where you always vote for your favorite team.

Yes, what the Paul family says about civil liberties, endless war and freedom are hard to argue with. The 2016 presidential election now is about choosing between two limousine liberals with identical positions on war, surveillance and civil liberties. I support neither.

I know what I don't like. I don't like the Bush--Obama--Clinton way of invading innocent countries, killing innocent people, mass surveillance, limiting personal freedoms, subverting the judicial system and then raising taxes to fund all of this.


I may not be 100% right, but if I'm going to be wrong, I want to error on the side of freedom, equality and the preservation of life
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
Martina has no choice but to vote for God emporer Trump!
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
Did you guys catch what went on in page 2 of this thread? I said the police are always watching groups like this. Sometimes they blend in, but always they lurk. Always on duty. Always snitching. You think they don't? Right away and a detective cop not far from Fresno graylx came after me because he didn't like what I wrote, my freedom of speech. Fresno police are watching what you write about them online. Do not let them intimidate you. Stand your ground!

I could have had it worse. Police raid homes of bloggers that call them corrupt. This blogger was exercising their 1st amendment right, freedom of speech! Do you live in a free country?






Welcome to the New America.

[ 2017-04-26, 12:54 AM: Message edited by: Martinna ]
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
Great police work GreyLX, anybody who threatens the cops threatens our society. Without the police there is no law and order, God bless the cops!
 

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Posted by CoyoteMike (Member # 13748) on :
 
Hopefully Martinna is in the next videos getting suicided by cop.

Please stay under your rock this time, you do not work "for the people" lol
 

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Posted by sic70stang (Member # 4347) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by CoyoteMike:
Hopefully Martinna is in the next videos getting suicided by cop.

Please stay under your rock this time, you do not work "for the people" lol

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quote:

---

Originally posted by sic70stang:

quote:

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Originally posted by CoyoteMike:
Hopefully Martinna is in the next videos getting suicided by cop.

Please stay under your rock this time, you do not work "for the people" lol

---

it is possible for you to disagree with people without wishing death on them.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by CoyoteMike:

quote:

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Originally posted by sic70stang:

quote:

---

Originally posted by CoyoteMike:
Hopefully Martinna is in the next videos getting suicided by cop.

Please stay under your rock this time, you do not work "for the people" lol

---

it is possible for you to disagree with people without wishing death on them.

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I do disagree with a lot of people and don't wish death on them. In this case, not so much. Hopefully the rock he hides under for 2-3 months at a time chokes him the fuck dead.

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quote:

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Originally posted by sic70stang:

quote:

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Originally posted by CoyoteMike:

quote:

---

Originally posted by sic70stang:

quote:

---

Originally posted by CoyoteMike:
Hopefully Martinna is in the next videos getting suicided by cop.

Please stay under your rock this time, you do not work "for the people" lol

---

it is possible for you to disagree with people without wishing death on them.

---

I do disagree with a lot of people and don't wish death on them. In this case, not so much. Hopefully the rock he hides under for 2-3 months at a time chokes him the fuck dead.

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I just could not imagine getting that upset with someone on the Internet

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You don't have to be upset to wish someone not be on this earth to spew garbage anymore
 

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Posted by sic70stang (Member # 4347) on :
 
i hope you dont have kids.
 

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Posted by CoyoteMike (Member # 13748) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by sic70stang:
i hope you dont have kids.

---

I do and hope they never have to deal with scumbags like Martinna
 

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Posted by graylx (Member # 3919) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Martinna:
Did you guys catch what went on in page 2 of this thread? I said the police are always watching groups like this. Sometimes they blend in, but always they lurk. Always on duty. Always snitching. You think they don't? Right away and a Fresno cop graylx came after me because he didn't like what I wrote, my freedom of speech. Fresno police are watching what you write about them online. Do not let them intimidate you. Stand your ground!

I could have had it worse. Police raid homes of bloggers that call them corrupt. This blogger was exercising their 1st amendment right, freedom of speech! Do you live in a free country?






Welcome to the New America.

---

What is there to catch? Although I am employed in law enforcement, I am not employed by the Fresno Police Department. I am not lurking, I am simply a Mustang enthusiast. Frankly, as an employee of yet another understaffed municipality, I am too busy with work to "lurk". There are enough assaults, stabbings, and shootings to keep us busy.

I have no problem with freedom of speech, I embrace it and am often amused by it. If you choose to express your opinion, however misinformed it may be, that is your choice.

I work in investigations, with an emphasis in gangs and violent crimes. Before that, I worked the streets. I have had my chips in the game once or twice.

The people I deal with (gangsters) realize that my contact with them is a business transaction. Rarely is it ever personal. I am in the business of fact, not emotion. I could care less about the race, ethnicity, or sexual orientation of someone. But if you shoot or stab someone in my town, my associates and I will probably come knocking at your door because we believe in accountability (and the law demands it).

The goal is not to intimidate, but enforce the law. The pictures you show reflect the reality that such weapons and equipment are necessary. As I am sure you are aware, many of these suspects don't stop in the name of the law.

We plan for the worst case scenario and many of these gangsters are well armed. The recent Stockton bank robbery shows how well equipped and organized some of the gang members can be. They were armed with assault rifles, took hostages, and led the police on a pursuit while firing at pursuing officers. During the North Hollywood bank robbery, the suspects had body armor and assault rifles while the initial responding officers had handguns. The police haven't become militarized because they like "toys", it is because we need to be better equipped than the crooks so we can defend ourselves and the public.

My goal is to get home at the end of the night. There are a few well-publicized police shootings that people bring forward to advance their argument about police brutality. Some deservedly so. Rarely do you hear of examples where the police successfully diffused a threatening, armed subject with a taser or less lethal weapon. It's not sexy to, say, the media.

The media is a business and the goal is to generate income. In order to generate this income, the media will report on a compelling or controversial event or narrative becuase that generates viewership and, in turn, advertisement revenue. The more controversial the event, the better the viewership. However, this does not always mean a correct reporting of "facts". The police have historically not commented right away because investigations take time...such as processing the scene, interviewing all involved parties, obtaining and reviewing surveillance, preparing and submitting reports. Then the brass and the DA will often review the reports. In the meantime, the media can spin whatever narrative they want.

I realize my reply is probably a little long, but I will conclude it with this. We are put in a unique position where we are closely scrutinized and have to make split second decisions based on our perception of known facts at the time. An often used word in our business is "reasonable". As in, "Is the officer's action reasonable given the facts and circumstances?" Although there are some examples of malfeasance, which have been widely reported, most of us want to do the right thing.

[ 2016-08-31, 10:30 AM: Message edited by: graylx ]
 

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Posted by Marks93 (Member # 11130) on :
 


You sir, are my hero! Very well written and stated.
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Marks93:


You sir, are my hero! Very well written and stated.

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True American hero!
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
And on a side note regarding the media, just look how easy it is for people in power to manipulate 70-80% of the news sources. They don't do this to benefit the people, they do this so they can federalize police which they have no business doing...
 

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Posted by phildog (Member # 1214) on :
 
All: please do not try and reason with Martina. This individual has made up their mind. Your time is better spent elsewhere, just stop feeding the troll.
 

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Posted by CoyoteMike (Member # 13748) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 135.0:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Marks93:


You sir, are my hero! Very well written and stated.

---

True American hero!

---

 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
https://youtu.be/6rMBhJVr28w
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
graylx ----- I am glad that you were willing to share your perspective as a member of the police force and to remind our members that the police do a difficult and dangerous job. All too often, our police are not given the thanks and recognition they deserve. This has been especially true in recent times.

As you said, the job of the police is to enforce the law. And the purpose of the law is to protect innocent Americans from those who wish to do them harm. All of us in this forum respect our men in blue, and don't want any harm to come to them in the discharge of their duties. We are also all Americans, and we extend that same good will to all of our fellow citizens.

Because we wish to protect the lives of Americans against those who wish to cause harm, we must provide our police with the best tools so that they have the capacity to save as many American lives as possible.

We should ask ourselves: what tools will allow our police to neutralize the threat posed by dangerous criminals while minimizing the chances of harm to innocent Americans? What types of weapons have, for example, the precision to stop a criminal in a crowded place without threatening the lives or safety of innocent bystanders? What procedures or policies should we implement as a community in order to save the greatest number of American lives?

Are grenade launchers and vehicle-mounted automatic weapons the answer to these questions? Are these weapons even necessary? These are some of the world's most dangerous and deadly war machines, and we shouldn't forget how these same weapons contributed to unintended deaths of innocents in Iraq, where nearly a million civilians have died. Now imagine these same armored vehicles rolling down American streets. I am interested to hear your thoughts on how these weapons of war will be effective at saving American lives and minimizing harm once they are put to use on American soil.
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
bump


 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
Bump now that the site is back. A Mark to give Officer graylx an opportunity to Hatch a response.
 

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Posted by DLo (Member # 6133) on :
 
Martinna, you pester more than a nagging wife does to her husband. I'm not law enforcement. But I have yet to see any police agency use a grenade launcher to launch a grenade anywhere. Contrary to what you think they're used for, they deploy them for non-lethal means. Find me an article or report of a cop throwing a frag grenade at a civilian and then I might be concerned.

I see your point with certain topics and some I may even agree with. The way you approach some of these subjects is going to get you nowhere.

[ 2017-04-12, 09:39 PM: Message edited by: DLo ]
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
DLo ---- thank you for the constructive criticism. Maybe my words trigger such an emotional response, that the reader loses a sense of rationality. This negates both sides goals. I will try to adapt. Police using grenade launchers against citizens was never claimed. It is true that across the country from Los Angeles School police got grenade launchers to Massachusetts police that got grenade launchers. No claim was ever made that grenades were actively being used against citizens. Maybe you are okay with Los Angeles School police owning grenade launchers as long as they don't use them. It is true Police have used a robot carrying a pipe bomb to kill a suspect. I suppose there are technical differences between a police using pipe bombs against its citizens and police using grenades. Inferring from earlier postings, maybe people here are okay with grenade launchers being used, as long as it's only against "gang members". For me, there is no valid reason for cops to ever own or use grenade launchers or anti-aircraft machine guns against their citizens. It is why I've politely Marked the post above so the officer conversant with the famously crooked Fresno Police department can Hatch a response.

[ 2017-04-15, 05:00 AM: Message edited by: Martinna ]
 

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Posted by 135.0 (Member # 4992) on :
 
Fresno cops are doing a great job! Keep it up!
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 


[ 2017-05-25, 02:18 AM: Message edited by: Martinna ]
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Martinna:
graylx ----- I am glad that you were willing to share your perspective as a member of the police force and to remind our members that the police do a difficult and dangerous job. All too often, our police are not given the thanks and recognition they deserve. This has been especially true in recent times.

As you said, the job of the police is to enforce the law. And the purpose of the law is to protect innocent Americans from those who wish to do them harm. All of us in this forum respect our men in blue, and don't want any harm to come to them in the discharge of their duties. We are also all Americans, and we extend that same good will to all of our fellow citizens.

Because we wish to protect the lives of Americans against those who wish to cause harm, we must provide our police with the best tools so that they have the capacity to save as many American lives as possible.

We should ask ourselves: what tools will allow our police to neutralize the threat posed by dangerous criminals while minimizing the chances of harm to innocent Americans? What types of weapons have, for example, the precision to stop a criminal in a crowded place without threatening the lives or safety of innocent bystanders? What procedures or policies should we implement as a community in order to save the greatest number of American lives?

Are grenade launchers and vehicle-mounted automatic weapons the answer to these questions? Are these weapons even necessary? These are some of the world's most dangerous and deadly war machines, and we shouldn't forget how these same weapons contributed to unintended deaths of innocents in Iraq, where nearly a million civilians have died. Now imagine these same armored vehicles rolling down American streets. I am interested to hear your thoughts on how these weapons of war will be effective at saving American lives and minimizing harm once they are put to use on American soil.

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Remember that time Fresno police executed an unarmed retarded man, commando style? The video------
http://abc30.com/news/body-cam-footage-freddy-centeno-shot-by-fresno-police/1261494/

I have a lot of respect for the good cops in California. They do hard work. It's true police have lots of problems and they’re bringing those problems to us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists... And some, I assume, are good people.


 

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Posted by SLOWBACK 67 (Member # 6348) on :
 
^ You know the North Hollywood shootout would have been stopped a lot sooner had LAPD had Rifles in their cars. Little known fact. The cops literaly walked into a gun store and used civilian rifles to put him down cause swat couldn't get there....... The same AR Rifles that state leaders believe we shouldn't own. The Irony.....


Another example would be the Rodney King RIOT.
That could have been prevented on the first day.
Oakland's Riots without armored vehicles would be a nightmare to combat against. The next big Earthquake is going to bring oit the savages looting, raping, property damage...... LEO's and GOOD People with guns will be the only people to protect the weak & injured.

Think of it a necessary evil, LEO's have had to update their tactics and equipment to combat criminals and possible terrorist attacks.
 

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Posted by graylx (Member # 3919) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Martinna:
DLo ---- thank you for the constructive criticism. Maybe my words trigger such an emotional response, that the reader loses a sense of rationality. This negates both sides goals. I will try to adapt. Police using grenade launchers against citizens was never claimed. It is true that across the country from Los Angeles School police got grenade launchers to Massachusetts police that got grenade launchers. No claim was ever made that grenades were actively being used against citizens. Maybe you are okay with Los Angeles School police owning grenade launchers as long as they don't use them. It is true Police have used a robot carrying a pipe bomb to kill a suspect. I suppose there are technical differences between a police using pipe bombs against its citizens and police using grenades. Inferring from earlier postings, maybe people here are okay with grenade launchers being used, as long as it's only against "gang members". For me, there is no valid reason for cops to ever own or use grenade launchers or anti-aircraft machine guns against their citizens. It is why I've politely Marked the post above so the officer conversant with the famously crooked Fresno Police department can Hatch a response.

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Your arguments are rife with logical fallacies (for example, fallacy of composition, appeal to emotion, confirmation bias). As such, they are defective.

[ 2017-05-29, 11:53 PM: Message edited by: graylx ]
 

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Posted by Martinna (Member # 12493) on :
 
graylx ---- Thank you peace officer for editing your original slightly hostile Bulldog post. Instincts from a bygone youthful era? Do not worry. I will not re-post the original version. Your new gentler tone is much appreciated. I assure you I have no interest in voluntarily visiting your precinct. You are no longer anonymous and on your own have started behave as such. An auspicious sign for all. Your feigned politeness will have to continue. It's essential.


Do you know Police Chief Keith Foster at Fresno PD? Of course you know Mister Foster was convicted this Spring for being a drug dealer? Please. You must read the Fresno Bee ----- http://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/crime/article152201757.html


Grenade launchers, war machines with roof mounted machine guns, the ability to snoop into anyone's cellphone. What more should we give you so you can serve and protect us sir? I saw in the news there are gang members out there. It will be a long time before the wall is built. Too too long. We need you to protect us now.



I have a lot of respect for the good cops in California. You are probably one of them. You do hard work. It's true police officers have lots of problems and they’re bringing those problems to us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists... And some, I assume, are good people.




[ 2017-08-21, 04:31 AM: Message edited by: Martinna ]
 

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Posted by Martinnaa (Member # 4992) on :
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&persist_app=1&noapp=1&v=9jts0jHaUlA
 

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