tryin to put together a good blower combo - Northern California Ford Owners

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Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

i have a 95 cobra with a s-trim with 12lbs. i have a custom luanati blower cam .512/.512, 224/236 duration @50 114 lobe sepo. now what heads and intake should i run? and what kinda of power should i be looking at?

Posted by 2SIK GT (Member # 3381) on :

heads im thinking AFR or trickflow twisted wedge im not sure but maybe around the 400 area .......give or take but i could be wrong and intake gt40 tubular or track heat

[ February 06, 2009, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: 2SIK GT ]

Posted by 92stangLX (Member # 3252) on :

Trick Flow Twisted Wedge heads and the Street Heat intake. Should be a pretty good mached combo. I would say 375-400rwhp.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

[Confused]

did i forget to mention it has a blower lol? 375?????? my car is puting down more than that as it sits!

[ February 06, 2009, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: blown95svt ]

Posted by Blind (Member # 3052) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
did i forget to mention it has a blower lol? 375?????? my car is puting down more than that as it sits!

have you dyno'd it?

I'd be really surprised if a stock gt40 heads/intake/95 cobra cam made much more than 350rwhp with 12#'s

I'm aiming for 400-450rwhp with trickflow heads/cam, edelbrock performer rpm intake, and 12#'s through a front mount intercooler with a blow-thru MAF and 42lb injectors with my `89.

Posted by 92stangLX (Member # 3252) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
did i forget to mention it has a blower lol? 375?????? my car is puting down more than that as it sits!

my bad

I did not see 12lbs of boost. Yeah, you should be around 450rwhp or so.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Blind:

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
did i forget to mention it has a blower lol? 375?????? my car is puting down more than that as it sits!
have you dyno'd it?

I'd be really surprised if a stock gt40 heads/intake/95 cobra cam made much more than 350rwhp with 12#'s

I'm aiming for 400-450rwhp with trickflow heads/cam, edelbrock performer rpm intake, and 12#'s through a front mount intercooler with a blow-thru MAF and 42lb injectors with my `89.

381/390 is what it put down, i was hoping to get into the 480 range, on corral they is 2 people who have broke 400s on stock motors

[ February 07, 2009, 01:23 AM: Message edited by: blown95svt ]

Posted by svfreerider87 (Member # 5748) on :

if I were to do it again I'd go with edelbrock upper and lower, and some performer heads, along with a water meth kit. top it off with a can tune from Kurgan or a good ole AED tune.

Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :

Edelbrock RPM heads, ported Performer Intake, TFS stage 1 cam, 42s, and NO tune with 12 psi on a stock block (93 Cobra) turned 417rwhp.

The hindering factor in your combo is the computer. It flat out sucks (if it's still the 94/95).

AFR 185s, fly-cut pistons to clear the 2.02s, Holley Systemax II intake, and a TFS stage 2 cam with a tune should get it around 430-440.

Posted by 1sick65 (Member # 3957) on :

the car has a fox computer swap

Posted by CobramanPhil (Member # 2170) on :

quote:
Originally posted by JohnB:
Edelbrock RPM heads, ported Performer Intake, TFS stage 1 cam, 42s, and NO tune with 12 psi on a stock block (93 Cobra) turned 417rwhp.

The hindering factor in your combo is the computer. It flat out sucks (if it's still the 94/95).

AFR 185s, fly-cut pistons to clear the 2.02s, Holley Systemax II intake, and a TFS stage 2 cam with a tune should get it around 430-440.

The 94/95 computers always get a bad rep [Frown]

It is a far better processor/computer compared to the fox A9 family. It is like comparing a 386 to a pentium3 or 4. With a tune, or perhaps a tuner piggybacked onto the processor all bets are off as you can make the stock j4j1/cbaza computer adapt to mods as any other processor would with a tune. The only advantage to the A9 is that you can get the car to run off the bat with mods (cam/heads/whatever) to an acceptable level(just not optimized as you will be leaving a lot of hp/tq on the table). Then again with any serious mods why would you go without a tune anyway [Confused]

. I'd say the limiting factor is the wallet [Smile]

[ February 07, 2009, 05:03 AM: Message edited by: CobramanPhil ]

Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :

quote:
Originally posted by 1sick65:
the car has a fox computer swap

Gotcha. Well, you may want to get it tuned then. There's possibly more in the combo.

As for the 94/95 processor vs the Fox...if they are a superior computer, why is the FoxSwap so popular? [Wink]

I agree, no sense in dumping $$ into a combo without going all the way and tuning it correctly.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

well it will be tuned the next weekend after the swap, as far as the cam go's what do you think about the specs johnb? and should i install this cam strait up? and i was really hoping to get close to the 500 relm, is there any hope? and i will be building a shortblock shortly after this also.

Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
well it will be tuned the next weekend after the swap, as far as the cam go's what do you think about the specs johnb? and should i install this cam strait up? and i was really hoping to get close to the 500 relm, is there any hope? and i will be building a shortblock shortly after this also.

There is a very slim chance of hitting 500 with the cam. It's a F-cam with a touch more duration. If it was in a turbo car or you were using meth-injection or nitrous, I'd say yes. If you are thinking of just swapping the cam, I'd wait until you build a shortblock and add a set of AFRs or ProComps and save your gaskets... [Wink]

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

no the car is stock right now with the exception of longtubes and a fox computer. im gonna be doing the h/c/i next weekend, i bought that cam from a guy that made 505 at the wheels.

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
well it will be tuned the next weekend after the swap, as far as the cam go's what do you think about the specs johnb? and should i install this cam strait up? and i was really hoping to get close to the 500 relm, is there any hope? and i will be building a shortblock shortly after this also.

it's possible but if I were you, I'd back down the boost slightly, or you're putting that motor on borrowed time....

with a set of AFR 185's and the cam that you have; I'd go with a Systemax intake...

on 12 lbs; methanol; and a proper tune; you'll be hovering the 475+RW area.....

just remember you're going to need to upgrade more than just a fuel pump in that case...fuel rails SHOULD be a must for you....

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

quote:
Originally posted by jordan_0806:

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
well it will be tuned the next weekend after the swap, as far as the cam go's what do you think about the specs johnb? and should i install this cam strait up? and i was really hoping to get close to the 500 relm, is there any hope? and i will be building a shortblock shortly after this also.
it's possible but if I were you, I'd back down the boost slightly, or you're putting that motor on borrowed time....

with a set of AFR 185's and the cam that you have; I'd go with a Systemax intake...

on 12 lbs; methanol; and a proper tune; you'll be hovering the 475+RW area.....

just remember you're going to need to upgrade more than just a fuel pump in that case...fuel rails SHOULD be a must for you....

with the 185s i will most likely have to notch the pistons??

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:

quote:
Originally posted by jordan_0806:

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
well it will be tuned the next weekend after the swap, as far as the cam go's what do you think about the specs johnb? and should i install this cam strait up? and i was really hoping to get close to the 500 relm, is there any hope? and i will be building a shortblock shortly after this also.
it's possible but if I were you, I'd back down the boost slightly, or you're putting that motor on borrowed time....

with a set of AFR 185's and the cam that you have; I'd go with a Systemax intake...

on 12 lbs; methanol; and a proper tune; you'll be hovering the 475+RW area.....

just remember you're going to need to upgrade more than just a fuel pump in that case...fuel rails SHOULD be a must for you....
with the 185s i will most likely have to notch the pistons??

yep...but TW heads would be good too....you won't be losing much, if any, on stock motor...

Posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT* (Member # 5909) on :

its about 300 right now. dont kid yourself.

H/C/I....your lookin at about 387rw....max!

that cam is horrible for your street car btw....

matt! whats the specs on your smogable 140mph trapping cam??

[ February 07, 2009, 04:44 PM: Message edited by: RED@7kVERT *8850GT* ]

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT*:
its about 300 right now. dont kid yourself.

H/C/I....your lookin at about 387rw....max!

that cam is horrible for your street car btw....

matt! whats the specs on your smogable 140mph trapping cam??

12#'s on Gt-40's should be around the 350RW; I was giving him the benefit of the doubt with the 380+RW.....

with just methanol and heads; he'd be over 400RW easily....it's been done time and time again...the right cam and intake make up a good difference as well....

Posted by 166 Merlot (Member # 1549) on :

@7K -just curious but why you think that cam isn't a good choice for a street car.

I'd run Trickflows and an edelbrock intake. My Saleen put down 450 to the wheels without the meth on a 130k tired oll motor with an s-trim.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

thats why im trying to get the right proven combo the first time. if i need to i will order a custom cam

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
thats why im trying to get the right proven combo the first time. if i need to i will order a custom cam

I would spend the extra dough and get a custom cam...

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

quote:
Originally posted by 166 Merlot:
@7K -just curious but why you think that cam isn't a good choice for a street car.

I'd run Trickflows and an edelbrock intake. My Saleen put down 450 to the wheels without the meth on a 130k tired oll motor with an s-trim.

hes being a smartass! lol thats what i like to hear, what intake and cam were you running and were the heads out of the box? and how much boost? was it tuned? thanks!

Posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT* (Member # 5909) on :

smart ass yes indeed.

matt im sure is on a similar cam as it is a custom SMOGABLE blower cam and traps 139's with a not too far off combo...id say the cam hes got is perfect for what the car is the only problem i see with it is the LSA, its 114...i think optimum would be more like 115-116. shit. people on theturboforum make 1000+ hp on F cams....give me a break.

the car is going to be nasty. bottom line.

thread/

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT*:
smart ass yes indeed.

matt im sure is on a similar cam as it is a custom SMOGABLE blower cam and traps 139's with a not too far off combo...id say the cam hes got is perfect for what the car is the only problem i see with it is the LSA, its 114...i think optimum would be more like 115-116. shit. people on theturboforum make 1000+ hp on F cams....give me a break.

the car is going to be nasty. bottom line.

thread/

matt's cam probably has a little more lift than .512..and for his combo 114 is probably as much lsa that car would want....

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

well im going to buy some twisted wedges and have them mildly ported and run that cam and a rp2 or a systemax and see what it does if im not over 450 im selling the car lol

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

what do you think that car would run with 450rwp? the car has full supension minus k member and front arms, i will swap the coilover springs to some softer ones and the car will have slicks. 3.55s also

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
what do you think that car would run with 450rwp? the car has full supension minus k member and front arms, i will swap the coilover springs to some softer ones and the car will have slicks. 3.55s also

I think it will make 1 orr 2 runs before it destroys the transmission into pieces....

but if it makes the power; prob 10.9's - 11.2's @ 126-128

[ February 07, 2009, 06:28 PM: Message edited by: jordan_0806 ]

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

i would be happy for a while with that, and ya i forgot about the car having a t-5 [Frown]

i might wanna look into a g-force tanny. what rate spring what you rec for drag? the car has coil overs all the way around, tourqe arm,panhard bar, lower control arms and full leanght sub frames.

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
i would be happy for a while with that, and ya i forgot about the car having a t-5 i might wanna look into a g-force tanny. what rate spring what you rec for drag? the car has coil overs all the way around, tourqe arm,panhard bar, lower control arms and full leanght sub frames.

I forget; but I think it's 250 lb fronts and 125's in the rear...

don't forget to get a wideband as well....

i might have my innovative up for sale soon.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

ya well i might pick that up off ya, and maybe those injectors if you have them next week, my maf is an sn style. ya hopefully next weekend i will start tearing into her, then have sean at aed tune it.

[ February 07, 2009, 06:43 PM: Message edited by: blown95svt ]

Posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT* (Member # 5909) on :

is it the cars fault it won't make 450? Or is it the combo or the dyno?

If it dosent make 450 you should prolly sell it.......

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

im just blowin off steam!!! lol i love that car!!!!!!!! sn cobra FTMFW!!!!

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
im just blowin off steam!!! lol i love that car!!!!!!!! sn cobra FTMFW!!!!

Posted by AJBlackGT (Member # 3936) on :

8.5:1 Compression 306, AFR 165s, ported edelbrock rpm, anderson b31 blower cam, and 15psi. Made 510rwhp...

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

well here are a couple combos from people on corral that cheered me up:
Stock 100k shortblock
GT-40 iron heads
B-21 cam
Holley Systemax
V-2 S trim @ 15psi
75mm TB
80mm Mas air
60 lb injectors
AODE w/ 4000 stall

500 RWHP, 450 RWTQ
Ran 10.60 @ 122 mph

have : stock block 0.30 over
novi 2000
afr 185 heads
systemax II intake
70mm TB
80mm MAF
powerpipe
42lb injectors
1.6 rockers
e-303 cam
longtubes

493whp / 439wtq on 10psi (stock pulley). Im not sure why a stock 302 shortblock would make any less power than my rebuilt 306.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

check this out stock longblock unported!

Yep, as Rio has said.....
Stock longblock with a Camshaft Innovations cam, and a S-trim made 505 rwhp and 467 rwtq. This is the 107,000 mile engine that Ford installed in my car back in 1994.

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
well here are a couple combos from people on corral that cheered me up:
Stock 100k shortblock
GT-40 iron heads
B-21 cam
Holley Systemax
V-2 S trim @ 15psi
75mm TB
80mm Mas air
60 lb injectors
AODE w/ 4000 stall

500 RWHP, 450 RWTQ
Ran 10.60 @ 122 mph

have : stock block 0.30 over
novi 2000
afr 185 heads
systemax II intake
70mm TB
80mm MAF
powerpipe
42lb injectors
1.6 rockers
e-303 cam
longtubes

493whp / 439wtq on 10psi (stock pulley). Im not sure why a stock 302 shortblock would make any less power than my rebuilt 306.

Brandon, not trying to rain on your parade but those combos are different from yours....so it's not going to make it any better for you to keep "bench" dynoing like that...

your best comparison is going to be the 2nd car; he's got a close combo to yours but better heads, a different cam, and longtubes (not sure you're going with those or not).....

just get your combo done and see what it puts out....even if it puts out 449RW; pretty sure that is going to be more than enough to smoke your drivetrain, clutch, etc....and be enough to break that block as it is....

Posted by streakmatt (Member # 6257) on :

quote:
Originally posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT*:
matt! whats the specs on your smogable 140mph trapping cam??

Thats why its custom, only I know the secrets! [Big Grin]

...I'll say it has more lift and LESS duration than Brandons [Wink]

[ February 08, 2009, 03:46 AM: Message edited by: streakmatt ]

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by streakmatt:

quote:
Originally posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT*:
matt! whats the specs on your smogable 140mph trapping cam??
Thats why its custom, only I know the secrets! ...I'll say it has more lift and LESS duration than Brandons

dick.....lol

Posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT* (Member # 5909) on :

quote:
Originally posted by jordan_0806:

quote:
Originally posted by streakmatt:

quote:
Originally posted by RED@7kVERT *8850GT*:
matt! whats the specs on your smogable 140mph trapping cam??
Thats why its custom, only I know the secrets! ...I'll say it has more lift and LESS duration than Brandons
dick.....lol

Posted by CobramanPhil (Member # 2170) on :

quote:
Originally posted by JohnB:

quote:
Originally posted by 1sick65:
the car has a fox computer swap
Gotcha. Well, you may want to get it tuned then. There's possibly more in the combo.

As for the 94/95 processor vs the Fox...if they are a superior computer, why is the FoxSwap so popular? I agree, no sense in dumping $$ into a combo without going all the way and tuning it correctly.

Well in stock unmolested and untuned form the 94/95 processor has some pretty sedate settings. No argument there. The tune is also very sensitive to cam/timing changes. That is why the fox swap is so popular. You can get the car up and running (not safe) enough to drive it over to the dyno to get properly tuned [Smile]

Then again people are just happy making the swap to get their hard parts in and then call it a day without a tune.

I'd say with anything with forced induction I'd pick the 94/95 which is load based...

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

how do these heads sound? tea 185 twisted wedges with 2.02/1.6 ferra 6000 valves and wire locks 65cc? with my cam and ?????intake

Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
how do these heads sound? tea 185 twisted wedges with 2.02/1.6 ferra 6000 valves and wire locks 65cc? with my cam and ?????intake

I hope you're going to fly-cut the pistons. That's going to hit if installed straight up.

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

i thought the trick flow heads cleared? i know i need to check the clearence

Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :

My bad, missed the twisted wedge part. [Cool]

You should be fine, but definitely check it out!

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

ok sweet! you started to stress me out!!lol i was about to just get some good ol 1.9/1.6 performers and hogg hem bi**hes out!

Posted by blown95svt (Member # 8893) on :

do you think a 185 head will be a bit much on my combo?

Posted by 93PONY (Member # 60) on :

quote:
Originally posted by CobramanPhil:

quote:
Originally posted by JohnB:

quote:
Originally posted by 1sick65:
the car has a fox computer swap
Gotcha. Well, you may want to get it tuned then. There's possibly more in the combo.

As for the 94/95 processor vs the Fox...if they are a superior computer, why is the FoxSwap so popular? I agree, no sense in dumping $$ into a combo without going all the way and tuning it correctly.
Well in stock unmolested and untuned form the 94/95 processor has some pretty sedate settings. No argument there. The tune is also very sensitive to cam/timing changes. That is why the fox swap is so popular. You can get the car up and running (not safe) enough to drive it over to the dyno to get properly tuned Then again people are just happy making the swap to get their hard parts in and then call it a day without a tune.

I'd say with anything with forced induction I'd pick the 94/95 which is load based...

The problem with the SN95 computer is that you can not datalog load. Which means you can't accurately tune it for all driving conditions. This becomes increasing difficult the further from stock you modify the setup.

If you can't verify the load table in which the computer is pulling info from at any given moment, it makes it very difficult to dial in an accurate tune.

Hence the recommendations to swap to a Fox computer.

It is true the SN95 computer is superior.....but if you can't use it to it's potential due to aftermarket software 'issues', what use is it? The 2 years these computers were made are like an ugly step child of mustang PCM's. Nobody bothered to make the proper equipment & software to properly dial in these things because the OBD2 stuff has excellent data logging capabilities.....& the Fox stuff is very basic. (no load based tables)

Posted by CobramanPhil (Member # 2170) on :

quote:
Originally posted by 93PONY:

quote:
Originally posted by CobramanPhil:

quote:
Originally posted by JohnB:

quote:
Originally posted by 1sick65:
the car has a fox computer swap
Gotcha. Well, you may want to get it tuned then. There's possibly more in the combo.

As for the 94/95 processor vs the Fox...if they are a superior computer, why is the FoxSwap so popular? I agree, no sense in dumping $$ into a combo without going all the way and tuning it correctly.
Well in stock unmolested and untuned form the 94/95 processor has some pretty sedate settings. No argument there. The tune is also very sensitive to cam/timing changes. That is why the fox swap is so popular. You can get the car up and running (not safe) enough to drive it over to the dyno to get properly tuned Then again people are just happy making the swap to get their hard parts in and then call it a day without a tune.

I'd say with anything with forced induction I'd pick the 94/95 which is load based...
The problem with the SN95 computer is that you can not datalog load. Which means you can't accurately tune it for all driving conditions. This becomes increasing difficult the further from stock you modify the setup.

If you can't verify the load table in which the computer is pulling info from at any given moment, it makes it very difficult to dial in an accurate tune.

Hence the recommendations to swap to a Fox computer.

It is true the SN95 computer is superior.....but if you can't use it to it's potential due to aftermarket software 'issues', what use is it? The 2 years these computers were made are like an ugly step child of mustang PCM's. Nobody bothered to make the proper equipment & software to properly dial in these things because the OBD2 stuff has excellent data logging capabilities.....& the Fox stuff is very basic. (no load based tables)

I am able to view (real time) and datalog pretty much anything with my TweecerRT (including load, loadx, MAF Kg/hr, o2's, A/F, etc,etc whatever...too long of a list) on my j4j1/CBAZA 95 cobra computer. The basic areas in which information is pulled depends on OL status (which btw can also be controlled via the software).

Can the fox computers calculate anything over 100% load? The 94/95 computers can and I imagine that would be useful in a blower application, but we are talking TweecerRT and not SCT stuff (I am not an expert on SCT or any other of the current crop of tuners so I am not very sure of their capabilities or lack of R&D for the 94-95 computers, but I do know what works for CBAZA and the 94-95 tunes are done pretty well with this particular software (user can control EVERYTHING).

Bottom line...I just don't see any sense in purchasing a fox computer when the blown application calls for a tune anyway. Its like throwing away a perfectly good eec. [Wink]

[ February 14, 2009, 05:44 AM: Message edited by: CobramanPhil ]

Posted by jordan_0806 (Member # 5888) on :

quote:
Originally posted by blown95svt:
do you think a 185 head will be a bit much on my combo?

No, because of the blower...

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