This is topic New Engine: opinions please!! in forum Tech Talk at Northern California Ford Owners  .


To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://californiafords.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=005308
Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :
 
Ok, it's like this...

I don't want to keep the original engine in my 93. Simple as that. I know I'm on borrowed time as it is, pushing the amount of boost, coupled with the junk 93 Pistons...so it's like this...

If you had "X" amount (less than $2k) what shortblock would you build? Keep in mind it must be 302-based (I wanna use the same distributor, headers, etc) but I'd be getting a new balancer and flywheel...so strokers are in. I am SOOO on the idea of a 347, but a simple 306 sounds good too. I've got Heavily-ported RPM heads (2.02) and the cam will be the Stage 1 Trickflow (possibly different if the combo would warrant the change). The Blower stays. [Wink]

What's your opinion?
 
Posted by BOUNTY HUNTER VERT (Member # 2754) on :
 
either way you look at it the stock block is going to split at 550rwhp. Buy a cheap 306 from ccm or coast for 1600 bucks and be done with it that way when it splits you are not out as much $$$
 
Posted by Glenn (Member # 520) on :
 
here ya go $1499 [Big Grin]
http://www.dssracing.com/306.htm

or, buy that sportman block that was for sale awhile back for $800 and get the 306 low compression kit for $659:
http://www.californiafords.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=010772
http://www.dssracing.com/306_piston_&_rod_kit.htm

[ September 02, 2003, 10:13 PM: Message edited by: Glenn ]
 
Posted by mustanggt5091 (Member # 444) on :
 
331 is my vote! [worship] [worship] It would go great with your blower! [patriot]
 
Posted by Blue Oval (Member # 2548) on :
 
CHP has a nice stroker kit u could by i personally would go with the 331.i bought a kit from them very good quality stuff. [Smile]
 
Posted by Jeff S (Member # 371) on :
 
Go to your local junkyard and pickup a nice $100 302 shortblock. You can make just as much power with it as any other stock block based 306/stroker and it's much more economical. Then you can take that $2000 and put it towards a REAL shortblock down the road.
 
Posted by BOUNTY HUNTER VERT (Member # 2754) on :
 
[patriot] i agree completely
 
Posted by st5150 (Member # 51) on :
 
You have a powerdyne blower right? I'd keep the 302 and use that $2K towards a S trim once the powerdyne blows up.
 
Posted by DropTopFox (Member # 1689) on :
 
331 [patriot]
 
Posted by BOUNTY HUNTER VERT (Member # 2754) on :
 
the 331 and 347 posts here are cracking me up. If his car was n/a id say go for it but since he is a poweradder car it dosent matter if he has a 331 or a 347 or a stock 302 the block will split at 550hp so lose 100 bucks when this happens or 2500 bucks its your call. So save the money for a r302 and run the hyperutectic cobra shortblock i have seen well tuned hyperutectic shortblocks take 500 boosted hp easy as long as there is no detonation.
with the heads he has a good cam and 10-12lbs of boost 500 rwhp easy.
 
Posted by Yellow94GT (Member # 431) on :
 
Call me crazy here, but I don't see any combo listed here that will even come CLOSE to 550 rwhp. With those heads and cam, and for damn sure that stock cobra manifold if that what he's planning on going with, he wont make block breaking power.

From what I've seen, he is going to need the extra cubes just to make the thing run half way strong. JMO
 
Posted by BOUNTY HUNTER VERT (Member # 2754) on :
 
think for the future
 
Posted by Jeff S (Member # 371) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Yellow94GT:
Call me crazy here, but I don't see any combo listed here that will even come CLOSE to 550 rwhp. With those heads and cam, and for damn sure that stock cobra manifold if that what he's planning on going with, he wont make block breaking power.

From what I've seen, he is going to need the extra cubes just to make the thing run half way strong. JMO
I wasn't aware he had a Powerdyne but ported Edelbrock heads a TFS stage 1 cam and a Cobra intake will make 500rwhp eaily with boost.
 
Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :
 
As it sits, it was a solid low 12 sec car. I'd just slap the cam and heads on, but from what I've found, the 2.02's won't clear on the stock pistons. (note: I have not physically checked) If anyone has run this setup, and didn't have clearance problems, lemme know. As of now, I'm favoring a .030 302, Probe pistons with a 9-9.5 to 1 CR and a good set of rods. Basic rebuild throughout, with quality hardware. As for bustin' the block, I don't think I'm quite there yet.. [burnout]

Edit: it's a Paxton SN-93. Pushes 10-11 lbs of boost.

[ September 03, 2003, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: JohnB ]
 
Posted by stoauto (Member # 2803) on :
 
imo maybe you should go for a sportsman block, if you can swing the extra cash, just so the thought of splitting the block isn't in the back of your head. But if not, GOOD LUCK. BTW, how much rwhp do you think your combo is going to make?
 
Posted by stoauto (Member # 2803) on :
 
imo i think you should also run lower compression like 8.0:1 or 8.5:1 maybe. just me. everyones got different opinions, but thats what you wanted to know though right, opinions. heres mine.
 
Posted by FordPny (Member # 510) on :
 
I would definetly recomend Keith Kraft, other then the $150 shipping charge that sucks http://www.keithcraft.com/shop/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=11&cat= good for mid 9's with a solid cam and lots of boost [Wink]
 
Posted by stoauto (Member # 2803) on :
 
oh and were you saying that you were going to slap your heavily ported rpm heads on and stage 1 cam in? with 10lbs of boost on a completely stock bottom end?
 
Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :
 
Yes, I've been running 10+ lbs for about a year now on a completely stock 302. Daily driver, over 7k miles.
 
Posted by stoauto (Member # 2803) on :
 
wow thats good. [Cool]
 
Posted by Chosen1 (Member # 1906) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by FordPny:
I would definetly recomend Keith Kraft, other then the $150 shipping charge that sucks http://www.keithcraft.com/shop/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=11&cat= good for mid 9's with a solid cam and lots of boost [Wink]
I found keith craft set up that is the most comparable with my stroker short block, and am I supposed to be offended that they refer to it as the "econo-stroker"?
 
Posted by ON N2O (Member # 2067) on :
 
-
 
Posted by ON N2O (Member # 2067) on :
 
my old rims -
 
Posted by st5150 (Member # 51) on :
 
The SN-93 isn't known to be too reliable either.... I'd still save the money for something else down the line. As for "stage 2" ported performer heads, they probably flow what AFR165/Trick Flow Twisted Wedges flow box stock, so along with that cam and 10ish psi of boost, you're looking at ~450 rwhp. I'm all for the stock bottem end. Your '93-95 short blocks can take 425-450 rwhp with no problem. I think Corbramanphil on here has put 50K+ miles on his 420rwhp 10psi boosted '94 short block and its still going strong.
 
Posted by cegan (Member # 3185) on :
 
John,

Keith Craft Racing offers a 306 stock plus, SVO Block, Steel Crank, SRP Pistons Eagle Rods. etc, for $1949.00 or 331 stroker plus $1549.00 with a choice of pistons, J&E, Ross. What ever you do don't go with DSS.....

p.s. the heads would work with either one of these
set-ups
http://www.keithcraft.com
 
Posted by Yellow94GT (Member # 431) on :
 
I have a friend who's sn93 took a dump on his brand new motor and chewed the whole thing up. I don't see that combo lasting very long. And once again, I dont see that setup as being cabable of making block breaking power without LARGE amounts of boost. (The only place I have heard of it being done is in places far far away, so I don't know how much of it I believe) [Wink]

I'm not trying to rain on your parade John, but I'd rather under estimate a combo than be disappionted in the end [patriot]
 
Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :
 
I guess I should have stated a page ago that I'm not looking for a "number" this combo will produce. There is enough data and testing done to order up a combo and make a desired HP number. You're not raining on my parade Drew, it's all good. [Big Grin]
If I wanted a FAST car, I'd have kept my bigblock Dart. Seriously, I was curious as to the general opinion of what is out there available vs. what is being currently run. Just looking for opinions. [Smile]
The SN is brand new (internally), literally. It was rebuilt with all new parts 7k miles ago. Hasn't given me any problems to date.
 
Posted by Yellow94GT (Member # 431) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by JohnB:
I guess I should have stated a page ago that I'm not looking for a "number" this combo will produce. There is enough data and testing done to order up a combo and make a desired HP number. You're not raining on my parade Drew, it's all good. [Big Grin]
If I wanted a FAST car, I'd have kept my bigblock Dart. Seriously, I was curious as to the general opinion of what is out there available vs. what is being currently run. Just looking for opinions. [Smile]
The SN is brand new (internally), literally. It was rebuilt with all new parts 7k miles ago. Hasn't given me any problems to date.
OK, with that said, if it where me, I would suggest getting a stroker kit, (just go ahead and pick you favorite brand and displacement), through the parts you have on there, with moderate amounts of boost, (10 psi range), and run strong without having to max out anything, (displacement, boost, etc.) Once again, JMO [patriot]
 
Posted by st5150 (Member # 51) on :
 
So to give yet another option..... go the stock bottem end/306 route and spend the extra money on some TEA TFS heads which will probably give you more power than the extra cubes will on those ported performers.
 
Posted by JohnB (Member # 969) on :
 
Thanks for all the input folks! It looks like I am going this route...

Install the heads on my stock shortblock, fatten up on Injectors, throw the cam in, and have fun. [burnout]
The stock computer will go by the wayside for now, a A9L in it's place..and we'll see what happens. In the meantime, I'm picking up another shortblock...and a 347 will be built to replace this engine. Only the good stuff will go in it, and my car will be running while the buildup takes place. A stronger block is a possibility too for the buildup. [Wink]
 
Posted by st5150 (Member # 51) on :
 
Sounds like a good plan [patriot]
 
Posted by stoauto (Member # 2803) on :
 
347, damn good choice! [Cool]
 




Fueled by Ford Mustang Owners
on CaliforniaFords.com